I think Maurus is on to something.

All the while that Yeesha has maintained that the D'ni enslaved the Bahro, no conclusive evidence of their use as slaves has been discovered... So maybe, just like Maurus said, they weren't chained to be used, but caged, or locked out of D'ni as vicious predators.

After all, how does one defend against creatures that can teleport in and attack you at any moment no matter where you flee to? You have to find a way of confining them, either locking them up, or locking them out.

For the ancient D'ni, this wouldn't be slavery, but self defence, like building a wall around their civilization, or as the old saying goes, caging the tiger so one can walk the forest freely.

Is it any stretch of the imagination to think that Yeesha might see the hold that remained over the Bahro, and misinterpret it's purpose? Not in the slightest. Yeesha has passed judgement over the D'ni, and has condemed them as proud and abusive of their power. Let's not forget she is a self proclaimed messianic figure after all, with all the self rightous indignation and contempt that such a lofty self opininon comes with.

So far, no one has been willing to step forward and question which faction of the Bahro is doing all the killing, most clearly assuming that it's those who are still controled by the Tablet, but it's really just as likely that the free Bahro are the bloodthirsty ones.

Perhaps the Bahro who seem to be defending explorers against the others are the ones who remain bound by the Tablet, compelled by its power to defend the new residents of D'ni from their vicious bretheren?

_________________
Alec Winters KI 06399622

"History is irredeemable."
- Kain, Scion of Balance

Just a thought:
Perhaps the "Animals that could link" phrase merely means that the Bahro had the technology. The bahro stones are obviously not tablets, and the D'ni books are obviously not bahro stones. Maybe, there was a consensus among certain D'ni people that they were a superior race, because they could write linking books. Maybe, Yeesha is just pointing out that the Bahro had their own version of the Art. Perhaps, the "link at will" ability was some sort of Yeesha magic that Yeesha imparted in an effort to free them. This would eliminate the problem of why the bahro didn't simply link away when captured as slaves.

Just speculating

_________________

Proud member of "Bahro for the Ethical Treatment of Adventurers" (Beta)
Maybe, there's
Gathered Restorers Awaiting To Explore For URU Lives

I would like to point out for the record that (ICly) the DRC worked with Cyan Worlds to provide a dramitization of the Cavern and the stuff that went on within.

What may have happened is open for interpretation, since the games we've been presented can be considered works of fiction and the actual events are still clouded in guess and hypothesis.

How inaccurate the games are to the actual events may be what blinds us. Who's to say how extensive the overemphasis or underemphasis on aspects of history in the efforts to provide a marketable and entertaining game have colored generations of Explorers...

(Gotta hand it to Cyan though, it's a doozy of a concept and I think a lot of people don't pay attention to it.)

_________________
Can't goldfarm if you don't have an economy!

What if Esher already has the tablet and commands a bunch of Bahros to make us and the DRC go away?

_________________
MO:UL - Andrej
KI-# - 00294933

LordAndy wrote:

What if Esher already has the tablet and commands a bunch of Bahros to make us and the DRC go away?

If that were case, I would expect that we would all be fairly well screwed already.

Knowing Cyan, I would guess that Esher is unlikely to make such an appearance.

After all, if you really think about it, what can one do against an enemy who already controls a Bahro army? Nothing, except frantically try to free the rest of them before he decides to command them slaughter everyone... which would take significantly less time. That wouldn't leave us poor explorers much to work with to make even a brief stand to try and save the world, nor would it provide us anyway to escape. There is only one known spot in the all of known space and time where a person could relax, safe from the Bahro, and Esher's lab wouldn't come close to holding all of us.

There's no way to oppose anyone when they are holding the Tablet.

The more I think about it, the more the feral Bahro hypothesis makes sense. To defend ourselves, we would have to to find a way of undoing Yeesha's quest, and re-enslaving them. Instead of fighting a war, we would have to uncover the mechanisms used originally to control the Bahro, and figure out how to reactivate it, to regain control over the feral unleashed Bahro. Which I have to say, does seem more like Myst to me, than fighting a war against the Bahro, and much easier to impliment than a frantic and desperate search through every Age to find some megalomanic's evil stronghold of doom so we could possibly steal the Tablet from him.

I think we might be on to something here.

_________________
Alec Winters KI 06399622

"History is irredeemable."
- Kain, Scion of Balance

here is my little idea about what is happening with the bahro...

After Myst 5 the Bahro stone was given back to the bahro, it was after that seen as a symbol that show who is the leader of the Bahro race... but after some time they got divided in the question about the new visitors in the D'ni caves that they have seen.. one faction want to watch what we are doing and the other faction wants us to leave in any way they can get us to leave....

just my toughts....

Well, as far as I understand the timeline Myst V is yet to happen so the Bahro don't have the tablet yet.

_________________
MO:UL - Andrej
KI-# - 00294933

LordAndy wrote:

Well, as far as I understand the timeline Myst V is yet to happen so the Bahro don't have the tablet yet.

O.M.G... Not again...

Oh, yes it did certainly happen...

The great shame of forums is their complete inability to form a lasting history or collective consciousness to be instantly known by all readers. Or perhaps that is what search is for.

In any case, read this thread where I present all the facts and eventually convince the thread about the Myst V timeline:
"Myst V hints at something happened in 2005?"
http://www.mystonline.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=143


People who read this thread also enjoyed reading:

"Give us The Shaft in 2007"
http://www.mystonline.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5068

"Path of the Shell (PotS) IS DEFINITELY canon!!!"
http://www.mystonline.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6180

_________________
OpenUru.org: An Uru Project Resource Site : Twitter : Perfect Speed Is Being There.

Well, technically, while the events of Myst V did occur in 2005, Uru regards Myst V to be a game produced by Cyan, based on actual events (recorded in a journal, the DRC was supposed to have found, I think.)

So while, the events of Myst V have definately already occured, what exactly occured is a little fuzzy.

Logically, we can assume that Esher did not get the Tablet, because he would have had two years to dispose of the explorers, a task that could have been done in a day, realistically speaking.

Although we will probably find that things turned out just like in Myst V, we might end up getting an entirely different truth in Uru.

_________________
Alec Winters KI 06399622

"History is irredeemable."
- Kain, Scion of Balance

Does anyone actually know what happened to Esher after Myst V

Because he was taken by the Bahro and something happened to him

I'm just asking.............

_________________
I think, therefore I am.
I write, therefore I am dangerous.

Aliases
Robdog181 KI#: 03473604
Skydiver Robdog KI# 10145619

Robdog181 wrote:

Does anyone actually know what happened to Esher after Myst V

Because he was taken by the Bahro and something happened to him

I'm just asking.............

Good question and also another Yeesha mistake or a M5 non canon statement, or quite possibly a very important CLUE.
Yeesha told the Bahro "do to him (Esher) as you would to one of the least"... which brings up the question, what does one do to the least?

The answer to this is condictory to what Yeesha said in a bahro cave when doing the pillars, or was it?
Yeesha refered the bahro as 'The Least'! OR is Yeesha refering to two separite bahro clans, 'The Good bahro' the ones watching over us in the cavern, and the Evil ones called 'The Least'>? ALSO there was another lesser class of D'ni
also called 'The Least'. So what happened to Esher ummm maybe those bones of human remains we found in the teledahn holding cells could belong to Esher! ack! To really get this whole URU story right we must put in Yeesha
magic some call it, I call it the special ability only a few D'ni can ever master, a prodical child who was both feared and
reveared. only 2 other had a 'portion' of this power that we know of, The Great King and Esher (got the power through a bahro pelt) Yeesha got the full power but only for a short time ' My darkness lasted for only a short time' Yeesha says
in a bahro cave during your journey. ( This is when she aquired the 'Tablet' and wrote Relto among many other ages )
I like to believe she with the bahro & the tablet wrote some of the ages in M5 and changed others, Yeesha also saved
Kadish's life! during this time of her darkness or should I say madness? as she also said the tablet binds and corrupts
with its power all those who touch it. This explains why she is acting like a madhater in M5 (the tablet made her go nuts)

The bahro are enticed and mezmerised by the rosetta stone they are powerless to fight it and must obay the master
of the ART. As Esher said in the bad ending of M5.

Gehn if the Trap Book which had a picture of K'veer in it was actualy Aturus trading places with gehn, while you went down
into the star fissure in Riven, Atrus and Catherine linked out back to Myst. Then Gehn has probably been free
for a while now and probably in some other age or maybe he also could 'Return' as Yeesha 'Returned'!

. This story is so indepth and deep but as holey as swiss cheese. We still hanging on a few 'Key' questions
which I really wonder if they will ever be canonly answered through a few huge game updates or through an official
posting by cyan The book of M still has not come out yet either. I feel like Cyan has something Grand comming up
and if everything keeps going to plan then we just might get to link to Relestion! and visit Kleio and explore the city
on the 'Other' side of the lake as well as formitting Guild Hall and palace, there is a picture of Takolka Alley
before the fall, the image is seen in back of the Great Zero after you calibrate your KI. could this a clue
to a D'ni time travel link yet to be discovered? I believe Yeesha has already 'Fully' Restored the cavern city! to the way
it was before the Great Fall. She copied the Cleft perfictly she had the bahro also deliver copies of Ae'gura to each
of the Bevins. BUT all these ages are separite facits or realities in the quantom working of the Tree of Possibility.
( each one is our own ) , at the end of Tpots Yeesha take you to view a jaw dropping cut sceen.

I like to think that this cut sceen was the beginning part of a walk through the finished D'ni Yeesha takes you on
with tolkata Alley being the main place she leads you too. Yeesha leaves you for only a little while to explore as D'ni
people run about doing what D'ni do, but you are a ghost to them and they do not see you. it is like you are ole unkle
scrooge visiting D'ni in a time long sense past a time before the Great Fall. There is a new Yeesha quest journey
which you will have to figure out a couple of reeeeeeeeeeally HARD but fun to do puzzles to aquire 3 very special books.
(and they are not discriptive or linking books either,... although there are literaly 1000's of books through out but only
a few of them will work,...ie; Explorer made ages ) Remember Serenia? M4 the stone that took you into the spirit realm?
Well this stone or something very much like the one in serenia is found in the 'presant' city any only accessable if you
have finished TpotS and been taken back in time by Yeesha. Going to need a way back cause no one is going to solve
this next journey so easely, Yeesha makes a referance to it during your walk with her.

Maurus said:

Quote:

The tablet could have been created for that reason. perhaps the bahro were violent, warring creatures with extraordinarily dangerous powers that needed to be kept in check...and so the tablet was created.

Secondly, "Noloben" once again seems to be an issue here. Of what significance could it be? We know a great number of bahro inhabit Noloben and also Esher. Are the Bahro planning something? Perhaps begging us for help?

I believe after reading the book of life? sorry forgot what those 5 books were called, ( The ones upstairs by the clock room )
something in the 4th book said this statement;

'The Dam has been destroyed and the river opened!
He who unleased its fury, screams for mercy, and calls for help
but no one comes.
As death drowns him, it takes everything in its path.'

I enterpt this as The dam is/was the Rosetta stone in K'veer!
A flood of wraths (as Esher put it ) Bahro killing and wipeing out everything in their path!
If this canon theory is true and Watson was the stranger aka a Friend ( Watson admitted that he was that person )
then he has been dead for quite sometime now!!!

Isn't ironic that The Grower leads in the dark while the deceiver flails in the light? isn't that just explaining what satan actualy
was, for he was an angle of light and beauty, before his fall as well! (sorry for the religous point no pun intended)



BTW:
I'm a Myst hard core fan who has ADHD, this is why my posts are hard to understand and I jump around
like a superball at times, with what Im trying to say. I do the best I can a felt like I should share this with
everyone because I have had a few too many misunderstandings as of late to my posts.
So please understand this before you flame or post back with/without constructive critisem. TY
.

.

_________________
--=VoiZod=-- MO:UL is:
MOUL - KI - 07289007, MOULa - KI - 00815646,
UURU - KI - D'mala 00943458, TMP - KI 131549,
URU - KI - Atrus 03668735, Katran 00982487,
URUb - KI - 00356281

VoiZod wrote:

.....

Good question and also another Yeesha mistake or a M5 non canon statement, or quite possibly a very important CLUE.
Yeesha told the Bahro "do to him (Esher) as you would to one of the least"... which brings up the question, what does one do to the least?

What could have happened to one of the "least" ?
--- Humain's remain in the Gahreesen's prison (side cell)...



Btw, had the D'ni found a way to stop the Bahro from linking ?

See how this Bahro was impaled in the handrail in one side cell of the Gahreesen's prison.

Close-up view in flymode...
http://www.guildofmessengers.com/forum/topic/all-uru-and-myst-games-versions-pictures-gallery?page=5#comment-12900

One distinction that I rarely see people make, is that we (..or Watson) gave the tablet not to THE Bahro, but to A Bahro.

One might make the supposition that this individual (assumed immediately freed) could just as well as someone of a solidary persuasion, have been a Bahro equivalent of Ymur from Tehranee, maybe even old grudge himself and that this individual could have had the option to go all Esher on the thing. Judging by the forming of factions, this didn't happen though; individual choice seems to be there.
I wonder where the tablets are now and what function they fill, if they have not, as it could perhaps turn out, been destroyed.

I am really really keen on knowing how the whole man-on-Noloben thing would have played out, if it had happened according to the original plan, in Uru -- would it have been part of the tablets arc at all and how would THAT have worked (it does appear it would have involved those "se'er" characters)?

Jojon wrote:

I wonder where the tablets are now and what function they fill, if they have not, as it could perhaps turn out, been destroyed.

I am really really keen on knowing how the whole man-on-Noloben thing would have played out, if it had happened according to the original plan, in Uru -- would it have been part of the tablets arc at all and how would THAT have worked (it does appear it would have involved those "se'er" characters)?

I Agree The Se'ers must be awakened! ( those floating statues in the garden ages are the Se'ers )

The Shocking truth one that I do not want to think about is the fact that Yeesha was always talking about 'Returning'
What does 'Returning' REALLY MEAN? Yeesha says some pretty strong things like The D'ni took from the least, they
took and took and never gave anything back. Later that night while they slept their lives were taken! because what
is not givin back or 'returned' it will be Taken! There was something about writing an age too, that a life had to be givin
(what I understood this to be ) in trade for the age to work. So if 'The Art' was what the Bahro gave, then the ending of
Myst 5 where its said the D'ni returned and now live in Relesion(spelling) with none under the Maker.
Which means that the D'ni returned all their knowlage of the Art back to the Bahro! Which farther means that
The Art is now lost to the Bahro! WE MUST GET THAT Rosetta stone BACK! some way, some how! and fast!
IF we the New human D'ni are to EVER pratice 'The Art' again. But if a life has to be givin, Im not so sure we want
something like that.( if that is true)

The Bahro are out of control like african killer bees and very few docile honey bees left.
I suggest that we find the linking book to Nobelean cause the rosetta stone is probably there in the center hill, or
a dimentional copy of it. ( I believe Esher said the rosetta stone is in may places at once ).




.

_________________
--=VoiZod=-- MO:UL is:
MOUL - KI - 07289007, MOULa - KI - 00815646,
UURU - KI - D'mala 00943458, TMP - KI 131549,
URU - KI - Atrus 03668735, Katran 00982487,
URUb - KI - 00356281

Sounds like you are among those of us, who did speculate things, like that a linking book might came with a "hidden" Bahro slave, which would take care of the actual linking, or be constructed of Bahro parts, or something, which would, as you say, make the good ending of MystV truly the "end of ages" and suddenly leave every book impotent. (EDIT: ...or at least new ones, for the latter cases.)

It has however been officially stated that the Art and the abilities of the Bahro are separate; similar, but not related.