Kestryll wrote:

Something else I'd like clarified from the ones doing the max burn-out tests. Are ya'll numbering the ovens based on the control room, or is 1-4 just the order in which you were testing them?

I think it would make sense if everyone was on the same page about which oven is which. I use the numbering based on which numbered push button in the control room activates which oven.

As you enter the oven/mixer room (the door with the power switch) coming from the control room via the vats and face the elevator push button, the oven directly to your left is #4, the far one on the left is #3, #2 is directly to your right, and #1 is the far one the right.

pellet
dispenser
room

(door w/rockfall)
Mixer 3 Mixer 1
Mixer 4 Mixer 2
(door w/ switch)

vats

Control
Room

johnsojc wrote:

Kestryll wrote:

Something else I'd like clarified from the ones doing the max burn-out tests. Are ya'll numbering the ovens based on the control room, or is 1-4 just the order in which you were testing them?

I think it would make sense if everyone was on the same page about which oven is which. I use the numbering based on which numbered push button in the control room activates which oven.

That's what I was assuming, and hoping. Just wanted to make sure.

And, as long as we are being precise, any data reported has to specify whether the settings are using the 0-50 scale or the 0-100 scale. There are 100 positions on each slider (not counting 0 ). 0-50 scale readings should include 0.5 settings, i.e 0.5-1.0-1.5-2.0, etc, corresponding to 1-2-3-4 on the 0-100 scale.

Off topic comment: Why do people use 0-50? Because the correct Bahro formula is 40-30-20 for white light pellets which, when properly set on the sliders, is the 40th mark, the 30th mark, and the 20th mark on the sliders. There are 50 marks on each slider. (the kicker is there is a valid setting between each mark that makes a total of 100 possible settings.)
New for this version of Er'cana, 0-50 on the time scale is 0-5 hrs of real time. That makes one of the 100 settings on the time slider increment the bake time by 3 minutes (half marks). Each small mark adds 6 minutes.

OK, here is the 100 point curve for oven 4.
Time 20 (1hour), Amount 81, Time 1-100


For contrast, here is the curve for sin^2(A)


As you can see, if you squeeze the sine squared curve over so it peaks at 66 instead of 90, the curves are very similar. Something seems to be modifying the curve slightly, probably another factor related to the amount.

That curve looks more like a cubic polynomial than a sin² to me. Notice how it's not symmetric around the peak, but steeper around 81 than around 41. Try fitting a scaled version of -2x³ + 3x² to it (maybe 35*(-2(x/66)³ + 3(x/66)²)).

It fits a sine (not sin^2) very well, up to that peak. My coefficient-twiddling got me to

17.8 * (1-cos(x*pi/68))

Round that to the nearest integer and it hits nearly every data point up until 66. (The 1-cos() is just a trick to get a sine curve that starts at zero and rises to a peak.)

_________________
Andrew Plotkin (KI#00102725)
Uru Newcomer's Guide and Answer Sheet
-- http://eblong.com/zarf/uru/newfaq.html

1 - cos and sin^2 are the same thing, up to scaling. Specifically, 1 - cos(x) = 2 sin^2(x/2). Proof is left as an exercise to the reader .

As for a cubic, my graphing software says

ax3+bx2+cx+d

d=-0.0056, c=-0.0643, b=0.0261, a=-0.0002574

And that also fits well when rounded, although not quite as well.

_________________
Andrew Plotkin (KI#00102725)
Uru Newcomer's Guide and Answer Sheet
-- http://eblong.com/zarf/uru/newfaq.html

I'm sure I knew that about sin^2, twenty years ago. :)

_________________
Andrew Plotkin (KI#00102725)
Uru Newcomer's Guide and Answer Sheet
-- http://eblong.com/zarf/uru/newfaq.html

I think starting with sin^2 as the best guess at the curve is valid. The sine of what is the question. Since all the published info on actual data shows the curve varies linearly with the amount we can exclude it (maybe) from being the variable in any sine term. That leaves time and temp as candidates as the variable in a sine function.

We would need to determine why the peak is offset from peaking at 90. There are two simple ways to do this: scale the value of what you are taking the sine or pick an arbitrary point after which you start subtracting any increase over that point's value (or even a combination of the two).

Since the beginning of the curve of real data does not rise as rapidly as a pure sin^2 curve, it must be modified by some combination of the amount and possibly the time and/or temp. Using just the amount or some scaled value of the amount alone does not reproduce the curve so some other factor must be in play.

Then there are the limits. Oven 4 has the irritating habit of "shorting out" if the product of the time and temp are over a certain value giving an output of 0. All the ovens have certain points where increasing the amount, the time, or the temp have no further effect on the output.

This is a very complex problem of modeling a "real" world system and I'm not sure it is even possible to come up with a viable model just using the output values as a guide.