Ed Oscuro wrote:

The brightness is actually strongest in these black and white (maximum contrast) images. I don't know what overwhelming visuals you're referring to; I pointed to the very simple text-and-tan-background look of the old interface windows. It's muted, simplistic, utilitarian and elegant, I think. Size matters: The font you used is pretty huge but isn't actually more easily readable than the small text of the old Uru menus. Imagine it's early in the morning and you want to catch a seminar in Ae'gura...Oops! You misread the text and deleted your character. I'm dramatizing, but I don't think that big + unusual + very white = better than simple and small. Books are printed in a serif font.

In somewhat of an order: While the black and white images may be technically brighter, they are perceived by the brain as darker. I'm not against making it less contrast for readability issues, though. '

I think you are going off my original idea. Instead, base your arguments off Tweek's proposal or my latest design, which use easy to read serif fonts.

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So Picture4.jpg, the one with Yeesha (Myst V?) on it, is that correct?

No. Go to page two, scroll about halfway down and you should see my designs and Tweek's in close succession. These are the two designs I support.
(mine starts with > http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg2/King_Canute/Uru/Picture1-2.jpg < this picture)

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... but when you've joined that shard you're done with that choice and now you want to look at the hardhat in a 3D model viewer (I don't know why, because the low-detail texture will probably be somewhat embarassing close up on my 1920x1200 monitor, and even worse on the larger 1600x1200 one).

The hardhat was an example of an idea I had. Shards would be given certain "seals" or "badges" to indicate if they are; following strict canon, exceptionally less buggy, including the Descent, easy for beginners, test or theatrical shards, etc. These would prevent the shards from misleading people who had no idea which shard to join. For example, a shard website or promotional piece might mention that they "have less bugs" then other shards, when all the other shards the writer visited were just really buggy, or "is the best shard for beginners" et cetera. Seals would verify specific pieces of information about shards. The hardhat was a quick representation of an icon used for a "testing shard" seal, showing that the shard it was on would be used for testing and might have bugs.

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I'll give it a shot; unfortunately this is going to run on a bit. Just to make sure we're clear, when I said "backend" (and I think also "tools") I meant the obvious game menus, things like character creation and video options; things that could spoil the immersion if they were constantly brought up during a game. Before they begin running around the Cleft, the player is ideally (I write 'ideally' because we're not going to spoil the plot arc for new players, I hope; it's a fun journey even the fifth time around, but carries the most impact the first time) coming into the game with no distinct impression as to what Uru will be (not counting installer or box spoilers from the days of yore). They are roleplaying themselves or a realistic person journeying from somewhere in the modern world into a secret world hidden beneath our feet that has not given up its secrets for milennia - until now never seen before. Now, this person might have played Myst (made by a gaming company and based on this hidden world) or even some of the later games more like Uru visually, but when they enter it'll still be a unique experience. This is all pretty solidly based in the game canon.

Backing up and catching our breath, many of these simple UI elements are necessary evils. The video options and the login to a shard especially - this is a quiet time where the player prepares themselves to get a good experience, and later they'll leave that. The avatar creation screen, once your game is started, would be best to integrate more naturally into the game because you're obviously playing with your character's looks in the game world, and I think it's most effective when you can pretend to some degree that you're in front of that dresser (naturally with some reservations for the sake of good taste). But for the first time you make your character, you didn't know what Relto was (if you played the boxed version first, anyway, which has the intro that makes the most sense).

So we see why it's not an especially good idea to put spoiler images of Ages not yet visited (Picture12.jpg) on a "Register/Login" page. Yes, I know that the original retail box's velcro flap has a full-panel screenshot of said Age, but when you look at those screens it's of interesting architectural details on the side, not a substantial part of one of the Age's prime vistas. If you were intending that these pictures only appear if somebody has gotten that far in the game, then what about people who share computers? Either way, this approach adds more overhead, which in today's world isn't a major thing (what's a few more graphics on the hard drive) but I think the coding time required to put in all these pictures and stuff could be used better elsewhere.

I see what you are saying now. Picture 12 is not in the later designs, and the choice of picture I used there was just one of the first pieces of concept art I could find.

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Of course it's a design feature; I'm not dumb. It's a design feature that I don't think works. Hopefully I have indicated above sufficently well why many of these choices don't work for Uru (and also that I did adjust for the inherently rough look of these screenshots). Uru is not in the same league as "many games;" it is about exploration, not about showing the bad boss's castle on the loading screen so you have a goal whilst slogging through another linear 3D action adventure with questionable production values and design choices. Uru has used screenshots in places, such as a few dialogs, the installation and box of the retail boxed release, but they were either details or were from parts that were relatively easy to find. It was mainly about selling the game. I don't think we need to sell Uru with screenshots on the UI, especially not to somebody who's already playing the game.

Okay, I do not know which design you are arguing on, so I will counter for each one

My original design: Probably you are right.

Tweek's and my use of the grayscaled cavern view: You can't really see that much, definitely no spoilers. It makes the design a little nicer looking, though.

Tweek's use of D'ni for the avatar view: I don't like the avatar view at all. However, I think that picture was just the first or easiest Tweek could get at. I would advise that if he wants to keep that function, he put it in the Cleft or somewhere.

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And I happen to like the black and white (/grey) design. It is clean, simple, and elegant. Colorful menus can too easily look cheap and childish.

Is the tan Uru interface "cheap and childish?" Whose interface mockup is cheap and childish? I'm not going to say anything else because I don't like where that is leading.

As I may have noted before, I never got to play MOUL and so I don't know what the "tan interface" looks like. I also do not wish to mock or put down any other person's designs or ideas. I was simply putting a cautionary argument against a colorful, tackily bright, or gimmicky designs. That is all. Thank you for asking me to clarify and not creating furor.


Okay: People seem divided on the dark high contrast color scheme. Could Tweek or someone else make a mockup of Tweek's plan or my latest design in a softer color? Perhaps Kadish purple, the tan color everyone is mentioning, or a white/grey color.

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I don't see why not. I hate it when games don't let me change the appearance of my character after it's been created, or at least charge massive amounts of (in-game) money to do so. Most things can be changed in real life -- you can dye your hair, there are colored contacts for your eye color, you can gain/lose weight... skin color doesn't change, but you could say you're using body paint. Of course, changing some things would be unrealistic, such as facial features; nose length/width, chin structure, etc... unless you claim to be getting plastic surgery though I still think you should be able to change that, but maybe with a restriction on how often it can be done.

I'm not saying it shouldn't be possible at all, just that it should be possible only before you actually log in the game. Because IC-speaking if someone can change his physical appearance it would take time, and it wouldn't happen in D'ni. That would avoid the weird situations of seing someone go to his Relto and come back just two minutes later looking totally different... While this can be fun I don't think it belongs to Uru.

It is unrealistic to change things drastically, but I think we should leave it up to the players. Maybe make it harder to change facial features, weight, etc. but let them do it nonetheless. People who want to be respectedly IC will be realistic (unless they have a specific reason to suddenly change color or something) and those who don't want to be will not.

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The news scroll for one - not sure what I think about how useful it would be, since I find "regular" emails more useful. But it's an interesting use of the space for certain.

I also thought that was interesting.

The "tan" interface can be seen in a screenshot here (http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r48/Paradox22/KIIntro.jpg). Note that the image was taken for a bug report, and you should not have a KI interface at the player select screen

Paradox wrote:

The "tan" interface can be seen in a screenshot here (http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r48/Paradox22/KIIntro.jpg). Note that the image was taken for a bug report, and you should not have a KI interface at the player select screen

Thank you. I can now know what people were talking about.

I see no reason why a similar color scheme could be used while employing Tweek's interface design and shape, perhaps along with a lower contrast background (from the one he has now).

I looked at everything again and came back with completely different (and newly relevant!) thoughts. I suppose I can stand by my comments earlier as pure theory harangues, but many of them simply don't apply to the screenshots before us, which was unfortunate and useless of me.

Hey Gehn,
Apologies for the confusion caused by mixing in responses to all your various iterations. You did ask me to respond specifically to the last one, so I've got no excuses there.

Likewise to Tweek, I dunno what was happening to me that I sounded so negative on your concept. The situation is clearly not so dire as I made it sound

Back to Gehn's concept for now: Going specifically only by the last pic - I still disagree with the complexity of the font, the high contrast scheme, and also placement of various elements. The large URU icon in the middle and superfluous elements like Yeesha's quote capture one's attention, whereas the important stuff is on the side.

Your idea of having categories fold and unfold as you click on them (I'm guessing based on the ~ and circle with a ~ through it) is sound, but perhaps unsuited for this type of application. It's weird to have the icon for a category change when it's clicked on when it doesn't look like the usual indicator a menu can be unfolded (the down arrow). If anything I would have a circle with a vertical arrow through it when closed, and a horizontal line when open. The downside of using a fold-out or drop-down design is that it leads the player to expect all menu items will unfold, whereas for a category like "donations" you probably don't want that being handled solely in the browser. If I am sending a donation through PayPal or credit card, I want to do it through the security of my browser of choice, no matter how much confidence I may have in the build of client I am using.

Unfolding menus are typically used where space is at a premium (i.e. drop-downs on HTML pages), and it's not at this point in Uru (despite what I said earlier about being able to see around the edges of menus), which is why I say the fold-out seems unsuited in this particular instance.

At this point I'm thinking it might be best to have the client use a simple browser, such as (again) various Valve Source engine games do (there used to show a custom MOTD, message of the day, with extended features as available on an HTML page including flash plugins), or to give the player the option of launching a browser to go to the shard host's website, which many applications do with a little disclaimer / warning popup ("Would you like to close the application to visit the website?).

Speaking of people being "stupid," as Gehn says, I think that using the term "shard" on the main menu, in both Gehn's and Tweek's designs, would present an unfamiliar element to some players. Most people on this site have heard of shards, but people who aren't familiar with MMOs (like Ultima Online, where as I recall the term originated and ironically is tied to that specific game's mythology) might not be familiar with the term. On the other hand, everybody who has played World of Warcraft (I'm not one) seems to know what a "server" is, I believe.

About the classic "tan" interface:

I didn't remember it looking that bad. I still somewhat like how it's organized when you want to go to change or view the few applicable options in-game on the offline version, but the font and color scheme could probably use some overhaul. Meanwhile, the important login details were very rudimentary on the boxed Uru, and not much improved on the Live version. So now I see more clearly the careful thinking behind and necessity of Tweek's changes to a system that either didn't have important features implemented as well as possible (like deleting characters) or didn't have them implemented at all (like most of the stuff behind the Shards, which were never a part of the old Uru).

I like how simple the old UI is, but honestly the color scheme on this Forum is nicer (probably because of the sepia/reddish contrasting with the two-tone tan). The rather out-of-place pale blue icons, while cute, should be improved with higher contrast colors. You shouldn't need to squint to see what you're looking at.

Here is a picture of what I was thinking about (more or less) on the old UI "tools" (what I was calling the "backend" earlier):

http://kamiharbinger.com/camera/20070331_uru_options.png
(Incidentally, the blog post this picture is featured in is quite critical of Uru's UI, and indeed it could be improved.)

The good news is that the font could be changed - I like the one Tweek uses - and the number of categories could be changed.

So, onto Tweek's concepts:

Looking at the Creating and Deleting An Avatar pictures from Tweek's concept: It does make sense to simultaneously show your roster of existing avatars during the creation of a new player name so you can check what names you have already given to characters, and it makes sense to set it off to the side so you can put more onscreen without scrolling. For that reason I think it shouldn't be faded or dimmed under an overlay.

So the main things I dislike about Tweek's version are the overlays, the white/black screen, and the avatar customization. I admit the screenshot used is much of a spoiler really, but I also don't see the use of a dark background with a patterned background - it makes it harder to see your character outline when you select darker clothing options. It makes more sense to use a solid color blank background on the dressing doll* for this reason, I believe.

Other random points, going on down the list of Login GUI concept screens:

On "Logging In:" Instead of "Change Shard," it could be "Find a Shard" (which looks more like a "Find Server" dialog to me, in this case what I would name "Find Game Hosts and Details" for the reason I mentioned about the nature of the term "shard" being limited to one type of game which not all free Uru players might be aware of, but that seems minor to me). That screenshot shows a shard's name appearing in a text entry box as if the player typed it in, and I doubt it'll be that easy to log into one; you'd need to enter details like the IP and port, unless you're planning on searching the names of shards...would be easier to do the old FPS standard of highlight and click "go."

"Shard Options" should have some network latency information, hopefully with some straightforward ping information. The TOS is vital, but I also think there should be a way for the shard to display some information about its community as a way of letting the player know, aside from ping, why they would want to play there. Again I think the simple in-game browser like in a Steam game makes sense here: everybody knows HTML and seeing a group's webpage lets you learn a lot about them while giving them flexibility over than an unformatted block of text.

Aside from the overlay dimming out the existing avatar roster, I mostly like the "Creating an Avatar" screen. I was going to say something about the "cancel" button but it makes more sense than "back" here, I think. After all, when you're at this stage, you lose your progress if you hit "back." Yet on "Shard Options" it would make sense to use "Back."

The "Delete a Character" dialog box is confusing as shown. I can imagine how it would work, but I think since the player won't need to type in an avatar's name after creating it, you could modify this to say: "To delete [put this first instance of the word in red] an explorer type the explorer's name in the box below." You'd have to be REALLY tired and possibly something else to type your character's name in and accidentally hit the delete button, since you never need to type your avatar's name, instead selecting it from a list. But if we wanted the extra security, we could change the text like so: "To delete [put this first instance of the word in red] an explorer type 'delete explorer's name' in the box below." I initially put 'explorer's name' in brackets but that conflicts with how I've formatted my post - I think you could substitute the name of a player to be deleted, if you select the player to be deleted by clicking their profile and then hitting "delete," or you could allow any explorer to be deleted from that box to save a step, I suppose.

Whatever the case may be on such fine points, I think Tweek's proposed explorer deletion process is vastly improved, and under no circumstances would the player not be aware they were deleting. However, I think it prudent to have the player write the name of the explorer, or to have it shown on the dialog (which it is not in Tweek's example), so you do not select the wrong explorer to delete; that explains my previous paragraph's purpose.

Main login screen needs a quit button, of course.

Conclusion: I like Tweek's concept more the closer I look at the details (instead of wrongly focusing on the general appearance), but I would change some minor details and would like the color scheme to be altered to become more eye-friendly. The font is very nice and professional, and the options are designed to prevent player mishaps.

* I'm really not sure why I persist in using this term. I suppose I should find a forum of people who are obsessed with the "create yer wrassler" screens from the pro wrestling games of yore and use the term there instead.

Ed Oscuro wrote:

Back to Gehn's concept for now: Going specifically only by the last pic - I still disagree with the complexity of the font, the high contrast scheme, and also placement of various elements. The large URU icon in the middle and superfluous elements like Yeesha's quote capture one's attention, whereas the important stuff is on the side.

Sir, you are still looking at the wrong picture . My most recent (and much changed) version is near the middle of the second page. It begins with this picture

Could a moderator edit my first post (I can't because it was edited to remove my large images) to reflect this?

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Speaking of people being "stupid," as Gehn says, I think that using the term "shard" on the main menu, in both Gehn's and Tweek's designs, would present an unfamiliar element to some players. Most people on this site have heard of shards, but people who aren't familiar with MMOs (like Ultima Online, where as I recall the term originated and ironically is tied to that specific game's mythology) might not be familiar with the term. On the other hand, everybody who has played World of Warcraft (I'm not one) seems to know what a "server" is, I believe.

Good point. I think we need to think up a new descriptive term.

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So, onto Tweek's concepts:

Looking at the Creating and Deleting An Avatar pictures from Tweek's concept: It does make sense to simultaneously show your roster of existing avatars during the creation of a new player name so you can check what names you have already given to characters, and it makes sense to set it off to the side so you can put more onscreen without scrolling. For that reason I think it shouldn't be faded or dimmed under an overlay.

So the main things I dislike about Tweek's version are the overlays, the white/black screen, and the avatar customization. I admit the screenshot used is much of a spoiler really, but I also don't see the use of a dark background with a patterned background - it makes it harder to see your character outline when you select darker clothing options. It makes more sense to use a solid color blank background on the dressing doll* for this reason, I believe.

(Just to clarify, you are talking solely here about the avatar customization screen?) We could replace the scene with a scene from the cleft instead. Few things blend into that, and even less spoilery than Ae'gura. A solid color is just a little too dull looking (especially since most single colors don't look good over large areas except for black, which would sort of defeat the purpose).

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On "Logging In:" Instead of "Change Shard," it could be "Find a Shard" (which looks more like a "Find Server" dialog to me, in this case what I would name "Find Game Hosts and Details" for the reason I mentioned about the nature of the term "shard" being limited to one type of game which not all free Uru players might be aware of, but that seems minor to me). That screenshot shows a shard's name appearing in a text entry box as if the player typed it in, and I doubt it'll be that easy to log into one; you'd need to enter details like the IP and port, unless you're planning on searching the names of shards...would be easier to do the old FPS standard of highlight and click "go."

Is this back on my obsolete design again?

Also, the whole point of this interface/directory would be to let people log in to any shard through one verification point and all. The shards would be listed out and clicking on one would take you to it.

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The "Delete a Character" dialog box is confusing as shown. I can imagine how it would work, but I think since the player won't need to type in an avatar's name after creating it, you could modify this to say: "To delete [put this first instance of the word in red] an explorer type the explorer's name in the box below." You'd have to be REALLY tired and possibly something else to type your character's name in and accidentally hit the delete button, since you never need to type your avatar's name, instead selecting it from a list. But if we wanted the extra security, we could change the text like so: "To delete [put this first instance of the word in red] an explorer type 'delete explorer's name' in the box below." I initially put 'explorer's name' in brackets but that conflicts with how I've formatted my post - I think you could substitute the name of a player to be deleted, if you select the player to be deleted by clicking their profile and then hitting "delete," or you could allow any explorer to be deleted from that box to save a step, I suppose.

I think just clicking the profile,hitting delete, and writing delete is simpler than hitting delete and writing out "delete [their name]". It also would seem more intuitive for me. The idea of putting the name in the dialog is good, though.

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Main login screen needs a quit button, of course.

You can just close the window/tab. The avatar customization screen needs a quit button, though. Otherwise you'd have to enter the game just to exit it. Also, the login screen needs a "register" button.

Gehn:

Sir, - Didn't realize that you were mod-edited, so I didn't know about that latest picture. To answer a question of yours later on, I ordered things so that the bold text represents a section heading. In Tweek's section I am talking about Tweek's images alone from that point on, and attempted to structure it so that it generally follows from top to bottom of Tweek's page (although I start back at the beginning after a few paragraphs, I believe). In the part where you ask about whether I am only talking about a specific screen of Tweek's: The last sentence was a general comment on the overall nature of Tweek's design. I would add that the avatar generation only gets me because of the screenshot behind it conflicting with being able to see your character (and the previously mentioned overlays and contrast issues). The much larger avatar image is an unquestioned improvement.

I think a straightforward and mostly unornamented menu would be more than just fine, like what Tweek has, or a fixed-up version of the "tan" menu of old. We get plenty of ye olde Dunny feeling in Uru itself; the menu is for necessary functionality, as I have opined before, only serving as a bridge between our world and the unseen one. What you've got there reminds me of an HTML page. I think there's a good argument for including a browser, so various servers can pretty up their TOS / description pages, but I would prefer the main interface to be simple.

That said, you're not without precedent: The retail box release has a launcher application with an image inside Yeesha's Cleft dwelling and some other stuff, and on the left side are some links you can click to launch various things (including the game). But I think this was cobbled together at the last minute.

So, basically, the ancient argument between form and function. Although I have some disagreements with some specifics, Tweek's balance between form and function is actually very close to where I'd like it. The font is pleasant to look at, color is used sparingly to make it stand out on the explorer deletion dialog (for functional reasons), without flashing lights and garish hues being necessary to attract attention.

Here are my manus. Thanks for the GIMP advice, tweek!

[Deleted]

_________________
Previously known as "The stranger"

Last edited by ThedStranger on Tue Jan 06, 2009 5:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

Ed Oscuro wrote:

So the main things I dislike about Tweek's version are the overlays, the white/black screen, and the avatar customization. I admit the screenshot used is much of a spoiler really, but I also don't see the use of a dark background with a patterned background - it makes it harder to see your character outline when you select darker clothing options. It makes more sense to use a solid color blank background on the dressing doll* for this reason, I believe.

As I mentioned before, the actual avatar customization screen would be the old one, not with a black layout.

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UruBlogs - Blogs from Uru Explorers
Tweek@Guild of Writers - Age development Blog.

Ed Oscuro wrote:

I would add that the avatar generation only gets me because of the screenshot behind it conflicting with being able to see your character (and the previously mentioned overlays and contrast issues). The much larger avatar image is an unquestioned improvement.

That is an easy fix. A different picture could be chosen to go behind (I suggest the Cleft).

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I think a straightforward and mostly unornamented menu would be more than just fine, like what Tweek has, or a fixed-up version of the "tan" menu of old. We get plenty of ye olde Dunny feeling in Uru itself; the menu is for necessary functionality, as I have opined before, only serving as a bridge between our world and the unseen one. What you've got there reminds me of an HTML page. I think there's a good argument for including a browser, so various servers can pretty up their TOS / description pages, but I would prefer the main interface to be simple.

I agree that the menu is for necessary functionality. It does not have to be flashily D'ni, or mystical. However, it should also look nice, modern, and professional. I think Tweek's design is the best in both of these categories.

Now on The stranger's design

Your firefly illumination idea is nice, but the font is not especially clear, and there is no shard/server/host/whatchamacallit switching functionality. All in all, I like Tweek's design better:
1. It has a shard/etc. switching functionality
2. It has a simpler interface that funnels the player to the game faster
3. It has a balanced and elegant look that your design does not attain.
I think we should stick with simple functionality and save mystical designs like yours for promotion and suchlike.

And, The stranger, it is spelled "menus".

Also, the Cyan logo brings up an interesting question. Can we/should we use this? Surely we want to give credit to Cyan and promote them. Surely also we want to not associate any bad things with them. Perhaps the logo with a little disclaimer? I don't know.

whoops. Photos deleted. Too many issues.

I was too rush with the modified things, I didn't notice the typos .

And about the cyan logo- I just put it there because it should be there, but of course it's just a design so... yeah maybe it shouldn't be there.

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1. It has a shard/etc. switching functionality

This will be done in an out-of-game menu.

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2. It has a simpler interface that funnels the player to the game faster

What can be more simple than 3 baisic options? I mean, you only click them, and I always thought uru needs an actual main menu, instead of beginning at the avatar choosing.

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3. It has a balanced and elegant look that your design does not attain.

Tweek is a photoshop master. My pic was done with paint, powerpoint, and 1 day experience at GIMP. My menu should look a whole lot more "elegent", but the concept I did, because of the programms I used, was... not.

Actully, I can understand you. It seems that I like exactly what you don't. Tweek's design, in my opinion, was too much modern. Everything lined up and all. It wasn't very interesting.

I realized the whole "menus should be simple" thing, but when it's too much simple, its not interesting.

_________________
Previously known as "The stranger"

The stranger wrote:

whoops. Photos deleted. Too many issues.

I was too rush with the modified things, I didn't notice the typos .

And about the cyan logo- I just put it there because it should be there, but of course it's just a design so... yeah maybe it shouldn't be there.

Yeah, I don't know whether it should be added or not. It could easily go either way.

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1. It has a shard/etc. switching functionality

This will be done in an out-of-game menu.

It makes more sense to me to put that in game, while putting the main menu options in a main menu out of game. Once you log-in, you can head all the quicker into Uru.

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3. It has a balanced and elegant look that your design does not attain.

Tweek is a photoshop master. My pic was done with paint, powerpoint, and 1 day experience at GIMP. My menu should look a whole lot more "elegent", but the concept I did, because of the programms I used, was... not.

Actully, I can understand you. It seems that I like exactly what you don't. Tweek's design, in my opinion, was too much modern. Everything lined up and all. It wasn't very interesting.

I realized the whole "menus should be simple" thing, but when it's too much simple, its not interesting.

I recognize that it is hard to make images against photoshop masters. However, I like the shape of Tweek's design. Your images were more... imbalanced. I found Tweek's design to be very sensibly interesting and mystical. It had a very orderly and professional Uru-ness. Simplicity can in itself make things interesting.

In the end, it is just a menu. With this in mind, I believe we should err on the side of simplicity, neatness, and professionalism, even if it is a little Spartan. Bare interfaces can be discouraging, but cluttered or gimmicky ones are worse. Also, Tweek's menu is made to quickly get the player into the real spots of interest and away from any problems they might have with the menus.

Fair enough. I have another idea in mind, simple one.

(though I will not settle for less tan handwriting! )

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Previously known as "The stranger"

My attempt. Simple, but lighter than Tweek's without being overly vague like Gehn's.

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-Whilyam

I always have the same question about 1280 * 1024 - why use it? It's a non-standard aspect ratio (5 * 4). Doesn't 1280 * 960 work just as well? (Standard aspect ratio of 4 * 3).

Now comes in coffee (tan) flavor, although I prefer the D'ni version myself.

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