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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 8:25 am 
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Ainia, what has happened there is someone applied the stamp (as you mention her name is missing) to the texture itself (instead of adding a second texture to the mesh or adding a new mesh with they symbol texture one). As a result this texture has then been used in multiple places in the Age and has caused the symbol to show up repetitively. In other words it's an error.


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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 12:06 pm 
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Woof. Okay, I'm convinced. She marked up Teledahn like a gang artist with a free lifetime pass at Sherman-Williams!

Tweek, in the game files, the monogram always has Yeesha's name in it, and is relatively small and square. It's certainly too small to use as a texture without distorting it to fit the surface being covered. For it to appear perfectly round with the name missing means that it had to be deliberately altered and applied. I just checked, and there's only one copy of it in the Teledahn files; it's the one they originally created for the floor of the Cleft rooms. I'll have to disagree that these were an error.

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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 1:20 pm 
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Yes, normally her monogram is a small texture with alpha transparency applied to it (clftyeeshaflooreng*0#1). When applied in game it is done in 1 of 2 ways.

1. a secondary UVtexture layer is added to an existing mesh, her monogram texture is then applied to that existing mesh. This adds the monogram on top of whatever texture is already on that mesh (for example the wall texture in Relto. As a result the monogram looks like it is carved into the huts walls.

2. A second simple square mesh is created and textured with the monogram texture, this mesh sits on top of an existing object (again like the walls in Relto) and again, gives the impression the monogram is carved into the walls.

Those Teledahn photos, that is not the case. In those images there is a single texture that someone has erroneously added the Yeesha monogram on (with the removed letters) as a single texture image, not separate meshes (tldnbucket*100#1) this texture was then used for multiple objects (which is common in Cyan's Ages they often reuse textures) which is what causes the logo to appear everywhere, and on every single step which is quite frankly obviously a mistake.

The texture in question (views taken from Blender) can be seen in full here:

[Reveal] Spoiler:
Image


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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 8:42 pm 
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Sorry to derail the thread a bit...but thought I'd interject where the GoMe hood is located...even if the restoration project is currently stalled.

Before setting up, we surveyed three potential sites. Finally, we settled on a spot that contains both a ferry landing and access to the D'ni tunnel system via tram car. There are likely to be extensive delays in opening the area up to the public, however...the Hood is simply sprawling. It's area is about twice the size of Bevin. It's location #2 on the map, and I've also attached a pic of the work currently in progress.

http://www.guildofmessengers.com/en/boo ... -selection
http://www.guildofmessengers.com/sites/ ... ion001.png

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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 8:59 pm 
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Beautiful. Do you have this up on one of the shards for testing?

I'm working on turning the GZ courtyard mosaic into a map of the cavern, since I can't get any of the other more accurate ones. Hope to have that available sometime in the not distant future. I won't be able to put any of the smaller islands that are in the blank areas of that, since I have no idea what's there, and I still need to get a decent version of Ae'gura to put on it. Then comes figuring out the map scale so that Ae'gura is the right size.

Sigh. Don't hold me to that "not distant" thing. But if I'm successful, I won't be stingy with it. ^_-

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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 10:28 pm 
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Tweek wrote:
...which is what causes the logo to appear everywhere, and on every single step which is quite frankly obviously a mistake.

;)

Yes, when I saw the stairs, I realized something was amiss. But it *is* fun to imagine IC scenarios that might explain it. My favorite is a Bahro teenager getting carried away with making Yeesha "art". :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 10:42 pm 
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Yeesha and a can of spray paint. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it. ^_^

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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 12:01 am 
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larryf58 wrote:
Beautiful. Do you have this up on one of the shards for testing?

Sadly, no, we're not even close to that point. The courtyard/dock is farthest along, just about ready for Phase-4a development, followed closely by the light garden. If I had turned my head a bit to the left, you would see what I mean. Adding a quick spoiler tag as a refresher on the stages of Age development for new peeps.

[Reveal] Spoiler:
RAWA » Mon Apr 17, 2006 1:12 pm:
OK. Here are what the phases mean both IC and OOC. There really isn't much difference. If you just read between the lines just a tiny bit, you'll see that the IC phases are nearly identical to the OOC phases each Age goes through.

PHASE 1:
* IC: Initial Mapping - During this Phase, basic maps and documents are created for the Age or location being restored. These documents are later detailed further in phase 3. Dr. Kodama is the head DRC member in charge of this phase.
* OOC: Initial Design - During this Phase, basic maps and documents are created for the Age or location being designed. This includes the design of the puzzles and story for the Age. [Nev's Note: Removed reference to non-functional link on Riven's.]

PHASE 2:
* IC: Structural Analysis - All structures and supports are examined for integrity and safety. Dr. Kodama also heads the completion of this phase.
* OOC: Massing Model - All structures are made in rough form to show their basic shapes and sizes. Little or no texture/lighting are done at this stage. Most of the wireframes at the 3D-history site mentioned earlier in this thread are massing models from Uru and/or DIRT.

PHASE 3:
* IC: Detailed Analysis - The Age or location is given a thorough examination by a survey team, which creates extensive maps and additional documentation on the area. Dr. Sutherland is in charge of this phase.
* OOC: Detailed Analysis - The Age or location (massing model) is given a through examination by the design team. We can walk around and get a "feel" for the Age and make changes while the Age is still in the early stages. Design documents are updated to reflect any changes in the Age's design.

PHASE 4:
* IC: Restoration - This is the most extensive phase, during which all machinery is repaired, structures are secured, and cleanup is performed. Mr. Engberg is in charge of operations in this phase.
* OOC: Detailed Modeling/Wiring - This is the most extensive phase. In fact, when Dr. Watson first explained the phases way back then, he said he could see this one being broken into two parts. IC, it makes sense to refer to both parts as one "restoration" phase. OOC, though, it really is two distinct phases.
4a - Detailed Modeling - Models are refined to final forms (structures are secured and cleanup is performed), textures are added, lighting is added, etc. Once phase 4a is finished, the Age will "look" complete. If you get a screen shot of something at the end of this stage, you might assume "Hey, it's done. Why haven't they opened it yet?", but there's still a lot to do - it looks great, but nothing actually works yet. (The Kahlo screenshots mentioned earlier in this thread are from Phase 4a.)
4b - Wiring - This is where everything in the Age is made to "work". Machines, elevators, doors, buttons, levers, triggers, puzzles, game-play, etc. Once phase 4b is done, hopefully everything in the Age works as it was designed. The Age is almost ready, now. (Kahlo was in this phase when it was suspended for technical reasons. Even now, it could end up stuck in phase 4b for a looong time, but I'm "cautiously optimistic" about that, too. :)

PHASE 5:
* IC: Limited Access - In this final phase before completion, the Age or location is opened for limited access by authorized explorers. Dr. Sutherland oversees the operations of this phase.
* OOC: Testing - In this final phase before completion, the Age or location is opened for testing by Quality Control (our in-house testers). They get to hammer on it, find bugs, and send it back to the phase 4 people to make fixes as needed. Once it's passed Phase 5 inspection, it can be opened to you all.

The phases, both IC and OOC, are not completely isolated. For example, The massing modeling of Age (Phase 2) will probably begin before Design (Phase 1) is 100% finished, so sometimes the Age is actually in two or more different Phases simultaneously, but we generally keep the listing at Phase 1 until Initial Design is complete, even if the massing model has started, then keep it listed as Phase 2 until the Massing model is complete, even if some of the Detail Analysis has started, etc.

While these two areas are ready to move into Phase 4, the remainder is not even close. All the major walkways are transversible, with large sections of the land under Phase 2 development. The book rooms, auditorium, are a bit better, being in Phase 3. All in all, don't expect anything but previews until fall, at best. Doobes still needs to get settled from his move. I don't even posses the most up to date schematic of the area, which is sadly still packed away with Doobes' desktop on the moving Pod.

Anys, think I've derailed the thread enough for the day. I'll post more sometime in the future.

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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 1:48 am 
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Okay. Looking at the GZ courtyard map mosaic, I see concentric circles radiating out from the center. They are regularly spaced.

Tweek pulled a rough estimate of the cavern's dimensions from somewhere that put it at about 10 x 6 miles. If you go from the farthest points the lake reaches, that figure is about the right number of rings.

Counting from the center of the mosaic, there's about three of those rings to the spot Bevin is supposed to be. We know that Bevin is 2.6 miles from the GZ. I calculate that to mean those rings are about 350 shahfeetee apart.

Since the D'ni figured things in base 25, does that figure make sense? It's 14 x 25, so it's a multiple of 25, which fits the concept. However, the d'ni mathematical notation system jumps from 25 to 625 from the second place to the third. 350 is expressed as | 14 | 0 |. The question is, would they use that figure as their equivalent of a mile or kilometer, assuming that the rings represent such a thing?

...and does anyone have any idea just how big Ae'gura is supposed to be???

Here's a look at how my try at a cavern map is coming along so far. It's too big to show in the forum, hence the external link.

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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 3:53 am 
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Fascinating stuff. I remember poring over D'ni words and maps for years and its great to see that enthusiasm is still alive!


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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 12:50 pm 
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Okay, my figure has at least one reference to back it up. Here's a quote from the Book of Ti'ana that seems to bear it out. It's nonsense, because we know that the central stalagmite of Ae'gura isn't a mile tall, but it's good enough for my purposes since they are talking about distances and we know that span is the word the author used for shahfeetee.

[Reveal] Spoiler:
Quote:
There was a pillar of some kind--a lighthouse maybe, or a monument--just beyond the great heap of rock that lay directly to their right, the top of it jutting up above the bluff. Yet as they rounded the headland, she saw, with astonishment, that the pillar was not as close as she had presumed. Indeed, it lay a good two or three miles distant.

"But it's..."

"Over three hundred and fifty spans high."

Anna stared at the great column of twisted rock that lay at the center of the glowing lake. Three hundred and fifty spans! That was over a mile by her own measure! Somehow it didn't seem natural. The rock looked as if it had been shaped by some giant hand. Looking at it, she wasn't sure whether it was hideous or beautiful; her eyes were not trained to appreciate so alien an esthetic.

"What is it called?"

"The ancients called it Ae'Gura," he answered, "but we simply call it The Island. The city is beyond it, to its right."


So, in the book we get two interesting facts. First, that 350 shahfeetee do roughly equal a mile, and second, that the D'ni at the time of the Fall called Ae'gura "the island", and "the city" was what we've been calling the city proper. Nice to know that my figure was pretty accurate, but I still don't know what unit of measurement the D'ni might have called that distance.

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PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2015 6:34 pm 
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My attempt at an accurate map now includes the positions of various locations according to their KI coordinates, and a rough guess about K'veer.

Using a scale that has 350 shahfeetee between each concentric circle of the map, that puts Ashem'en right on the edge of the visible area, and well away from the main lake.

Looks like the idea that it's in another cave has some weight to it. That would also explain why Ashem'en is lower than the water table in the D'ni cavern, and why the first two Great Excavators were needed to build it.

Click here to see the map progress. It's an 8 megabyte file, so it may take a while to load if you have a slow internet connection. I haven't begun to optimize it yet.

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 7:29 pm 
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By the way, not that it matters in this discussion all that much but the Opera House from the existing shots, was sized down for the Pre-Render test shots in which its included with the Guild Hall. These pre-rendered visuals were created to help the art team get the "look and feel" of the cavern down, as well as to explain to give the tech team working on Plasma 2 some insight into what Cyan wanted with regards to light mapping and bump mapping. These shots weren't intended to be seen as concept pieces for the city in anyway, but rather test art for what the cavern itself would look and feel like between day and night.

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 9:42 pm 
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Let me ask this again: Does anyone know about how big Ae'gura is supposed to be? Not the height, but the overall length and width.

Hmm. I suppose I can try to calculate it by the KI distance to the ferry terminal or library....

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 5:24 pm 
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not sure if this is the right thread to post it but RAWA just posted on the Mysterium chat with some D'ni words:

"Not sure if this has been released: ti-ko-leet - tiKolEt - adj. sorrowful, sorry (i.e "I'm sorry.") If that one's been released, try (b)zoo-doo - zUDU - v. to regret. The first has been in the dictionary a long time, but may have never been confirmed. the second, I just researched this morning."

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