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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 5:45 pm 
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Wow. I missed that chat session. Guess I logged out too soon. Yes, this is as good a place as any to mention it.

Two more words for the dictionary. Nice.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 6:47 pm 
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Acorn1 wrote:
not sure if this is the right thread to post it but RAWA just posted on the Mysterium chat with some D'ni words:

"Not sure if this has been released: ti-ko-leet - tiKolEt - adj. sorrowful, sorry (i.e "I'm sorry.") If that one's been released, try (b)zoo-doo - zUDU - v. to regret. The first has been in the dictionary a long time, but may have never been confirmed. the second, I just researched this morning."

Hi, Acorn and all, just in case I've taken two screenshots of what RAWA said in the Twitch stream chat (the time is my time PM, GMT+2, so, just count 6 hours back, as for EDT) ... That was really a nice surprise, indeed ... :D

[Reveal] Spoiler:
Image

Image

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 6:54 pm 
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thanks, janaba, I took a screen shot myself! It was so nice that we on the stream got something first, :mrgreen: to partially make up for our not being allowed to see the Obduction video at Mysterium. :(

They then read the messages from RAWA out to the Mysterium audience, of course.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 7:34 pm 
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Apparently K'laamas had already reported tikoleet, but zoodoo is definitely new.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:40 pm 
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And now we can do that zoodoo that we do so well. ^_^;

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 8:20 pm 
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Stay away from da zoodoo!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 6:39 pm 
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Just got to thinking about the Age name "teledahn".

Tel as a standalone word usually means guild. That makes sense in that Teledahn was written as a private rest Age for a grandmaster of the Guild of Caterers.

Edahn is a mystery. The word ahn has been seen before; it appeared in a crossword puzzle. However, the puzzle did not include translations, so a meaning has never been defined for it. Ed has never appeared in any word lists.

If we try to extrapolate a little, ed could be a shortened form of eder, meaning to rest or sleep. Similarly, ahn could be a shortened form of ahno, meaning water, although I do not know of any existing words that have ahno as part of them that drop the final o.

If that idea has any possibilities, then edahn (rest water or sleep water) could be a word for a form of non-moving water, like a bayou, swamp, or marsh. Given the overall characteristics of Teledahn, that could make sense.

However, edahn could also be a shortened form of eder plus ahnee, which means to get/become. That would more or less translate as "to get rest" or "to become rested" and could mean "vacation", which would jibe with the intended purpose of the Age.

So, teledahn could possibly mean "guild marsh" or "guild vacation" as two potential meanings.

Anyone else have thoughts about it?

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Last edited by larryf58 on Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:03 pm 
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Just a word of warning that sometimes the "obvious" word divisions are not actually correct (I recall a somewhat-humourous suggestion of ga-rís-en "and it eats" as a segmentation of the name Gahreesen before Rawa revealed the etymology). Segmenting Age names is... hard.

That aside, it's possible the name contains eder, considering it was written to be a rest Age (though I'd not put any money on that). There are a number of words containing an seemingly as a suffix of some sort, but no meaning is particularly obvious (though an interesting case is cavan "immortal" < cav "live"). The connection with tel is alluring, yes, but the Age was written to be a personal Age, not a guild Age, so I can't understand why its name would include "guild".

All in all, I'd say that this Age name is still of unknown etymology.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 3:21 am 
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And yet another word that has me scratching my head, this time because it seems to call for two suffixes, which doesn't make sense to me. I am trying to come up with a way to say "instructional".

shokhoo is a verb that means "instruct".
-tahv converts it into a noun, "instruction".

So far, so good.

But what adds an equivalent of the "-al" to it?

Should I be using -ehts? Thing is, if I do, I get shokhootahvehts, which is a double suffix, and I'm not sure that's permissible. My brain is fried right now, and thinking is making my gears slip.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:26 am 
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larryf58 wrote:
And yet another word that has me scratching my head, this time because it seems to call for two suffixes, which doesn't make sense to me. I am trying to come up with a way to say "instructional".

shokhoo is a verb that means "instruct".
-tahv converts it into a noun, "instruction".

So far, so good.

But what adds an equivalent of the "-al" to it?

Should I be using -ehts? Thing is, if I do, I get shokhootahvehts, which is a double suffix, and I'm not sure that's permissible. My brain is fried right now, and thinking is making my gears slip.

Two suffixes on a word is perfectly possible; compare baronet "phosphorescent" which is clearly a root bar (possibly an adjective meaning "bright" or something similar) with the causative/factitive suffix -on (compare elon "to raise; make high and ziþon "to lower; make low") and the characteristic adjective suffix -et (compare çevet "thankful").

For "instructional", šoxútav is definitely the place to start, and -ec is certainly one possibility. -et is another. Both would probably be translated as "instructional". I think, in order to decide between them, we're going to need some context.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 1:09 pm 
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I'm translating "2015 Cavern Tours". Since there are no specific words for cavern or tour in the current lexicon, I'm rewording for intent. Instructional Big Cave Journeys gets the point across in words that are available.

35% galpopara lenatE Sokotavex
35(15) galpopara lenatee shokhotavets
senravatseeheebor galpopara lenatee shokhotavets
2015 cave-big journeys instructional

I'm pretty sure that -ehts is suffix I want, since the journeys are instructional, not may become instructional.

Edit: I'm also including a welcome message at the bottom of the web page I'm making.

.regalpopara lenatE Sokotavex tAnEEt SemtE
.regalpopara lenatE Sokotavex tAnEEt SemtE

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:47 am 
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larryf58 wrote:
I'm translating "2015 Cavern Tours". Since there are no specific words for cavern or tour in the current lexicon, I'm rewording for intent. Instructional Big Cave Journeys gets the point across in words that are available.

35% galpopara lenatE Sokotavex
35(15) galpopara lenatee shokhotavets
senravatseeheebor galpopara lenatee shokhotavets
2015 cave-big journeys instructional

I'm pretty sure that -ehts is suffix I want, since the journeys are instructional, not may become instructional.

Edit: I'm also including a welcome message at the bottom of the web page I'm making.

.regalpopara lenatE Sokotavex tAnEEt SemtE
.regalpopara lenatE Sokotavex tAnEEt SemtE

Minor nitpicks - galpopara should either be compounded with lenatí (so no space) or stand after. Either is fine. Returning to -ec vs. -et: it's not a case of "being" against "may be", but rather, as far as I can tell, one of relation or property against characteristic. In this case, I think either is fine and has the desired meaning (so, something like "having instruction" and "characterised by instruction" for each).

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 1:30 pm 
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Both Kh’reestrefah's D'ni Dictionary and Domareh's (admittedly incomplete) language lessons agree that -ets is the word that converts nouns into adjectives.

Domareh doesn't mention -et at all, except as it is used to indicate "we". Kh’reestrefah mentions it, but qualifies it as a "suffix forming adjectives of potential".

To date, I have not yet found a definition of "adjectives of potential" anywhere, so I interpreted that as an adjective that is conditional; in other words, if the sentence the adjective is part of contains the words if or when, -et would be used instead of -ets.

So I'll freely admit that it was a guess about Kh’reestrefah's definition of the word in his dictionary, and if someone can nail down when -et would be used instead of -ets, that would be very helpful.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:07 pm 
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You're in luck, then, since I have a series of lessons in the works, as well as a reference grammar. Both are intended to replace Domareh's works, since they are now out of date. I'll keep you posted.

larryf58 wrote:
Both Kh’reestrefah's D'ni Dictionary and Domareh's (admittedly incomplete) language lessons agree that -ets is the word that converts nouns into adjectives.

Saying X is the anything is dangerous with language, since it's almost always wrong. Especially in this case. Every language I know of has many ways to form adjectives, and they generally all mean something different. For some English examples inherited from its parent language, compare "woody" and "wooden" - both are adjectives derived from "wood", but they do not mean the same thing. Now, sometimes the distinction isn't possible in English, without some very contrived expression, or simply not useful. I think the case of šoxútavex vs. šoxútavet is one of these.

While Khrees' dictionary is a wonderful tool, some of his definitions are... questionable. I would much rather describe -et as forming adjectives of characteristic rather than of "potential", and -ec froms adjectives of relation. To (briefly) summarise the difference in meaning, -et would be "characterised by" or (loosely) "full of", while -ec would be "of, pertaining to, related to" and roughly equivalent to English's suffix "-y". Thus har šorat is a "year characterised by peace" while galon prædec is "rocky ground".

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:28 pm 
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Okay, I follow you so far. But there's one more puzzle piece. Tefoonet.

Tefoonet (memorial) is made of teh + rifoon + -et. That's "in-remember-(adj)". How does that fit into your definition?

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