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 Post subject: Yeesha's tattoos
PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:24 am 
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Another April entry.

===

Thursday 4 Apr 2013

Yeesha’s Tattoos

In trying to examine Yeesha’s tattoos and discern the pattern, I noted with surprise that they appear different in Watson’s photographic records from his quest. The Yeesha tattoos we see in her imager messages and when she visits the Cleft are on the right side of her face on her cheek all the way up to her hairline; and on the left side of her face curling around her ear and extending to the corner of her eye. Watson’s photographs show only the tattoo on the right side of her face; the left side has no tattoos at all.

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In both these “instances” of Yeesha, there are other more well-known differences in her appearances. Her hair color and decoration, her clothing. She wears the desert bird symbol across her chest in both, though the coloring differs.

Because of these more well-known differences, the implication of a disparity in time already was apparent. However, the tattoos imply that Watson met a *younger* Yeesha than the one we see at the Cleft. How can this be??

We know that Watson’s quest took place during 2004-2005. The Yeesha with two sets of tattoos was already a well-known presence before that, both to explorers and to the DRC. The only explanation I can imagine for this is that Yeesha was messing with time somehow, perhaps sending Watson backward… Or even more interesting, perhaps Yeesha herself is a “time-jumper”. Could she be traveling back and forth across time? I would expect then that her experience of time is non-linear (at least in terms of the course of events) and thus completely different from our own. If this is so, then just as with the Bahro, she can go anywhere, anywhen. So perhaps she has learned to move outside of the Tree of Possibilities just as the Bahro have.

This is simply mind-bending.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:53 am 
Notice how the tattoo on Watson's Yeesha is somewhat smudged. Perhaps Yeesha did something to her tattoos between the time she recorded the Journey messages, and sending Watson to recover the Tablet.


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 Post subject: Yeesha tattoos
PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:22 pm 
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Shorah Kath,

Sadly, Watson's photo records did *not* include any closeup photos of Yeesha (the images I used here are cropped versions of the best examples I was able to glean from his records). I *was* able to get some good closeups of the double-tattooed Yeesha myself. So it's hard to say if the one set of tattoos is smudged or if it's just the poorer resolution I was forced to work with.

Perhaps I will revisit Watson's photographic archives again to see if I missed anything... but not for a while yet! I have too many other Hidden History research topics on my plate right now!! :D

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:17 am 
No, I am certain. There is a fair amount of space on the right-hand tattoo that is not present on the older Yeesha. I also cannot see even the hint of the lettering that should still be visible.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 5:57 am 
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Shorah Kath,

Hmm, things are getting curiouser and curiouser. I managed to find a better Watson picture of Yeesha and crop it. Here are the comparisons:

Front views:
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Side views:
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With the improved front view from Watson's photos, I'm not even convinced that these two tattoos are the same. :o The overall shape is very similar but the patterns appear to be quite different.

Just. Too. Weird.

I'm tired already and need some rest! I'll wrack my brain over this one later. :shock: :shock:

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 7:54 pm 
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Ainia, :lol: here is another brain wrecker< :)

If you notice Yeesha is the only d'ni person to wear a tattoo, I have seen no other true d'ni have one. Now the one thing we do know is the Art of Writing was done with special ink and special paper.
Yeesha's younger picture is very intriguing to me as far has the tattoo art work, especially the left side. Tattoos usually represent a status in cultures? or did some one just run out of special paper :) ?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:38 am 
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Location: Hanging around with mermaids. And still looking for the elusive Funky Bahro.
Remember: Yeesha learned her linking abilities from the bahro. Is it possible that these tattoos are made with linking book ink in order to help facilitate her powers?

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 Post subject: Holy heek!
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:44 am 
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Shorah DaVinci and TOOO,

I believe you've hit the nail squarely on the head regarding the significance of the tattoos! :o Well done!!! :D

We already know that the Bahro have a symbol etched or tattooed upon their necks/heads that is connected with their linking. RAWA has said that the Bahro are not born that way... so the Bahro have figured out how to connect the ability to link with a symbol they add to their bodies.

And so has Yeesha. In the two tattoos of the younger Yeesha, they each include her name written in D'ni. With the right-side tattoo, the surrounding imagery is that of her seal (which we see left in numerous places in her Journey Ages); so the entire tattoo around her right eye is her seal. Perhaps this symbol contains the power of linking not merely through the ink used but through the shapes too? Each Bahro linking symbol is identical to the others, so it causes me to wonder if there is intrinsic meaning and power for them in the symbol itself. Since Yeesha is not a Bahro, it makes sense that her symbol would differ from theirs...

The second tattoo of the younger Yeesha may have been added at some important turning point either in events or in her mastery over Bahro linking. Apart from her name, the rest of the left-side tattoo appears to be symmetrical, though the exact meaning of that part is elusive.

Regarding D'ni and tattoos, we actually don't know much if anything about their customs in that regardi. Gehn was still quite young when D'ni fell and would have been far too young for any sort of initiation that might have included tattoos; it's hard to guess how much he might have been told about such things at that young age. Atrus was even less familiar with D'ni customs and practices since his only exposure to them was through his father's somewhat twisted view of reality.

However, considering the apparent connection between the Bahro linking symbol and Yeesha's progressive accumulation of tattoos, I think it very likely that if the D'ni culture made use of tattoos at all, it was probably not connected with the act of linking (perhaps purely symbolic or decorative, similar to its meaning in our surface cultures of today).

This still doesn't explain the disparities between the Yeeshas... but perhaps gets us thinking in the right direction to understanding them.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:57 am 
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I seem to remember several of Atrus' Journals from the original Myst, where he was experimenting with several different kinds of ink--- one kind of ink actually surprised him when it turned different colors by the next time he saw it.

More telling is that one kind of ink actually faded and disappeared from the pages.

Now, these were just journal entries.. but knowing Atrus' natural curiosity and his desire for experimentation--- look what he did in Rime, for instance--- it's possible Atrus himself was trying different 'mixes' for linking book ink. He may have used them in a regular journal at first, just to see the effect before actually using these new mixes on a real blank book.

For whatever reason this disappearing ink may have a certain quality to it, and Yeesha has now used that ink for the left tattoo.

Bear in mind, also .. we're thinking "younger" Yeesha has the Tattoo, "older Yeesha" doesn't.. BUT that may not be the case. Were these photos taken in different Ages? It's possible the left tattoo disappears when Yeesha goes into certain Ages and reappears in others.



Okay... and here's one just totally RADICAL suggestion. We know that making changes to a descriptive book--- always using "writing ink"--- will make changes to the Age. Is it possible that by having "writing ink" on HERSELF caused Yeesha's own appearance to change--- such as her eye-color.... as if she herself were 'an Age' or becomes part of the Ages she visits, in some new, unique way????

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:34 pm 
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Please pardon my ignorance, but do we know that the tattoos ARE tattoos (pigment permanently embedded in the skin)? In color they resemble the henna stain designs people wear for ceremonies in places like India and North Africa. Long lasting but different for different occasions.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:17 pm 
HarveyMidnight wrote:
I seem to remember several of Atrus' Journals from the original Myst, where he was experimenting with several different kinds of ink--- one kind of ink actually surprised him when it turned different colors by the next time he saw it.

I know what you're talking about, but those inks were given to him by the indigenous people of Channelwood. They gave him inks to try, knowing that they would change colour, and found it very amusing to see his reaction to them.


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 Post subject: Permanent?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 1:57 am 
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Shorah ventris,

In terms of canon from RAWA, I have never found any statement that Yeesha's facial markings are tattoos, nor am I aware of any commentary by reliable witnesses (e.g. Atrus or Yeesha herself) that they are tattoos. All we can say for sure is that these markings have appeared in their present form on "younger" Yeesha since 2003. Her current visual appearance quite possibly dates farther back than that since we first see her via an imager recording made on an unknown date (that is, the recording could have been made the day before or years before the first time an explorer viewed it).

So if they are henna markings, then Yeesha (or someone) reapplies the exact same markings on a regular basis. Such a thing isn't terribly far-fetched since younger Yeesha also clearly shaves her forehead and above her left ear; she must do this quite frequently for we never see new growth but we do see a bit of "five-o'clock shadow" in the areas where she shaves. So she likely shaves daily or every other day (any longer between grooming sessions would result in a noticeable variation I would think); re-doing a henna application at the same time would be reasonable.

Tattoo or henna, I think the present theory remains unchanged, that the ink and patterns somehow emulate the Bahro linking abilities. And in terms of how long Yeesha has sported these facial markings (10+ years), she seems to intend them to be permanent.

If the present theory proves correct, then I would think the likeliest answer to your question is that they are indeed tattoos. The analogous Bahro markings are most definitely permanent and can only be removed by cutting away the marked flesh (as demonstrated by Esher's use of Nekisaloth's pelt). So I would expect that Yeesha's markings also would be permanent and that such permanence either is part of the Bahro "formula" or provides an important benefit.

Of course, we could get "out there" in terms of Yeesha sightings and suggest that every time an explorer sees her in the flesh at the Cleft when they finish their Yeesha journeys, Yeesha has messed with time and the explorer is not really at the present-day Cleft... If we consider this a genuine possibility, then we have a very limited number of genuine Yeesha sightings that we can date reliably. In which case her daily appearance and grooming habits are anybody's guess.

Being a fan of Occam's Razor, for now I favor going with simpler explanations and reserving the more complex for the point in time when the simpler explanations no longer fit the evidence. So the "out there" explanation is not my first choice just yet. ;)

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:18 pm 
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Again, I'm sticking my oar in with inadequate information, but if the question is change in her markings then something less permanent than tattooing is indicated. Since staining can last at least a week I think anyone who has seen women maintain elaborate make up all day everyday would say reapplying weekly is a minor inconvenience.

Since we know that D'ni linking involved the interaction of ink and paper then Bahro linking likely involved the interaction of pigment and Bahro skin. Did Esher indicate that he had isolated the pigment used but couldn't get it to work except on Bahro skin? Or did he indicate that it was something in the actual method of application that he couldn't replicate? Since Yeesha hasn't (as far as we can tell) got bahro skin then she most likely is using a different formulation of pigment anyway.

Do we have any indications about bahro pigments and bahro stones? Is it safe to presume that Yeesha created the stones as well as her journey cloths? In which case she has pigments that work without bahro skin or D'ni paper.

(does anyone else find it annoying that the spell check dictionary here marks words like bahro and D'ni for Pete's sake?)

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 Post subject: Yeesha markings
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:01 am 
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Shorah ventris,

At least in my mind, the issue of tattoos is only one of many that arise in trying to understand the two Yeeshas. My original journal entry was triggered by trying to sort out the sighting of the "older" Yeesha by Watson within the overall timeline. The paradox is that "younger" Yeesha has been seen regularly by explorers beginning in 2003. Watson's quest was from 2004-2005 and he interacted with and recorded images of the "older" Yeesha then. But during that same time and ever since, explorers have continued to see "younger" Yeesha.

So far as the records show, the only person to have interacted with "older" Yeesha is Watson himself, and only during the time of his journey quest (triggered by Phil's apparent death in December 2003). This Yeesha differs significantly from the Yeesha the rest of us have seen for ourselves, yet Atrus himself acknowledges she is indeed his daughter.

The differences in her clothing, hair color, eye color, etc. all are pretty obvious. The appearance of this "older" Yeesha is something of a larger puzzle for me in that at first glance, it appears displaced in time. This Yeesha *looks* overall as if she is a great deal older than the one we see for ourselves. So how is it that she seems to have "appeared" right in the middle of the Uru Cavern timeline?

There are other important seeming paradoxes embedded here too. Although I haven't yet posted the entries here, shortly after I began pondering the Yeesha tattoo question, I began investigating and journaling about similar K'veer paradoxes. The K'veer we see in Watson's records differs in some significant ways from the K'veers seen in The Stranger's records from Myst and Riven days; and from the two versions of K'veer we see in Yeesha's Path of the Shell journey; and the current day K'veer. I hope to start posting those journal entries here once we "finish" our discussion of the tattoos (in quotes since I don't expect we will nail down anything permanently).

And there is another time paradox regarding the Great Shaft, also revolving around Watson's journey, which was discussed to a degree in an older thread. At some point, all these paradoxes will need to get sifted through. My hunch is that they are painting an important part of the larger story.

Regarding the Bahro and Esher's "research"... In Watson's journey records, Esher justifies what Watson is about to find in the Noloben research lab, saying "I take no pleasure in what they have endured here... but I had to learn." Esher reveals nothing more to Watson about his Bahro experiments and we are left to interpret for ourselves what Esher has done and what he has learned from it. No one has ever found any of Esher's research notes. To my eye, it looks very much as though Esher must have used the Noloben snake venom to incapacitate each Bahro "research" subject, for his laboratory has a cage and there are numerous drawings of disarticulated Bahro anatomy. One of these laboratory drawings is notably different from the rest. Visually, it appears to have been drawn by someone else and it includes some Bahro writing symbols as well as an image of a tailed monkey-like creature with a peculiar symbol upon its back. This same symbol is enlarged separately on this same drawing and also is the symbol we see added to the Bahro upon their heads and necks. The Bahro version of this symbol isn't so much a tattoo as a scarification, for it has no tint but instead appears to be raised or contoured. I'm fairly confident that Esher tried for a very long time to replicate Bahro linking unsuccessfully; and I strongly suspect that the "monkey" drawing was done by a Bahro he tortured for that information. In the end, all Esher seems to have accomplished was to steal the Bahro's ability to link. [[If you are so inclined, you can read my annotated version of Watson's journey journal, where I talk a great deal more about Esher.]]

When we look at Esher's attire, we see that he is wearing a greenish "cloth" draped over his right shoulder. This item bears the same symbol shown in the drawing and that we see on the Bahro necks. Esher touches this symbol each time he links away after talking with Watson. So we are left to interpret for ourselves what this means. To my eye, this appears to be the results of his "research" and that Esher's "research" was focused on emulating the Bahro linking; and the only way he managed to do so was to repurpose a Bahro skin which had the linking symbol. I gather from this that Esher was unable to create a working symbol for himself; the best he could do was co-opt a working one from a living Bahro. Since Esher had plenty of time to work on this (he himself reports that he fled to Noloben at the time of the fall), I would assume he tried everything he could think of. If my hunch about the drawing is correct, learning that "secret" did him no good in terms of replicating Bahro linking, though it did reveal to him which part of Bahro anatomy to steal for his own linking use.

The Cavern events from December 2006 through the following November brought much of this gradually to light. Yeesha's last public speech in K'veer in November 2007 said explicitly that Esher's experiments led directly to the current Bahro civil war; that the Bahro whose pelt he took had survived and then formed the Twisted Faction which was following the path of revenge and violence. Rumor has it that this Bahro, called Nekisaloth by the explorers, is no longer able to link himself, but is transported about by his sympathetic followers. [[If you haven't already, you can read this history in The Heritage Documents.]]

Putting this information together with Esher's experiments, I think it extremely likely that Esher discovered that a co-opted Bahro linking pelt would work only if the Bahro remained alive. This presents an interesting parallel to D'ni linking technology, which requires contact with living tissue in order to work (though RAWA states that a gloved hand will also activate a link). It seems to me that living tissue is a vital ingredient, and that symbols are a vital ingredient. Perhaps the D'ni were unable to come any closer to Bahro-like linking than in using special ink, paper and symbols to create a stable link to a specific destination. The Bahro linking is much more flexible and powerful than the D'ni, with the ability to go where and when they choose without using books or other paraphernalia. Although Esher must touch the pelt symbol in order to link, neither Yeesha nor the Bahro we observe need to do anything similar. If the linking destination is determined through a thought or an intent, then perhaps the living tissue activates the link itself. So Esher's still-living victim would have provided him with the final "ingredient" needed to link successfully with the pelt, and the act of touching the pelt symbol somehow activated a connection between the pelt, Esher and Nekisaloth, enabling Esher to tap into the living tissue of the pelt owner.

This would highlight a significant difference between Bahro and D'ni linking technology. D'ni links are activated by contact with *any* living tissue, whereas there seems to be an unbreakable connection between the specific Bahro and his linking symbol. Only Nekisaloth can make his linking symbol work; only Yeesha can make hers work. Thus their linking symbols will continue to work only so long as they are alive.

Yeesha seems to have blended this principle with her Writing techniques, creating "instancing" links, books that travel (just as she travels with her tattoos), and (perhaps) links that mess with time...

As you can see, starting to dig deeper into understanding Yeesha's tattoos is rather akin to following a thread through a labyrinth. It intertwines with many other Cavern curiosities!! :D And the farther down this rabbit hole I dig, the closer I get to that "out there" explanation... :shock:

Keep in mind that much of the above is simply an example of how I sift through "stuff"--starting with a given, asking questions, looking "outside the box" and seeing where it takes me. We will probably never know if any of my ruminations are close to the mark and much of it may get discarded as these conversations continue, as I continue finding new paradoxes and questions to investigate and as new information comes to light.

(Of course, it would be fun if RAWA chooses to weigh in on some of this but I expect he's rather busy with more pressing matters! ;))

Whew, what a tome! :lol:

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 Post subject: Linking stones
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:38 am 
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Shorah again ventris,

I neglected to address your question about Bahro stones in my earlier "tome" so I will try to answer it here.

ventris wrote:
Do we have any indications about bahro pigments and bahro stones? Is it safe to presume that Yeesha created the stones as well as her journey cloths? In which case she has pigments that work without bahro skin or D'ni paper.

The only authoritative answer I have for the above is that we know the Bahro are very connected to the linking stones, for they replace them whenever someone moves them (much the same way Watson observed the Bahro to replace the Age slates for Noloben, Laki'ahn, Todelmer and Taghira when those slates were moved). Additionally, we know that they move the Ae'gura linking stones from time to time (sometimes the stones are present in the public Ae'gura, other times they are present in the hood "instance" of Ae'gura). I've read that each time one of these stones is moved, the Bahro doing so shrieks, perhaps announcing what he is doing.

Nick reported that the Yeesha Journey cloths showed similar properties; that if someone removed one, it was replaced later. I have never heard whether Yeesha replaces them or if the Bahro do, though.

I think it very likely that Yeesha created the journey cloths by combining Bahro linking principles with D'ni Writing principles. My own theory is that the linking stones are probably collaborative works between Yeesha and the Bahro, with the Bahro taking on a continuing role of ownership or oversight. Visually, that is how the stones strike me, as a blend of the Journey cloths and Bahro slates.

I don't know if anyone has ever tried to figure out exactly how they work, though. Sharper's journal entries about a Bahro stone imply that he and a Bahro were butting heads about exactly where a particular stone would be placed; Sharper didn't write anything to imply that he was trying to reverse-engineer the linking stone. Nick's note about his removal of a Yeesha cloth, coupled with some of the historical DRC statements about their general presence, implies that the DRC was attempting (unsuccessfully) to remove Yeesha's influence from the Cavern. So far as I know, the DRC never publicly admitted to researching the Journey cloth technology.

The way things are starting to look to me:
  • D'ni linking technology: paper + ink + symbols => Linking Book; Linking Book + living tissue => Age linking
  • Bahro linking technology: linking symbol + personal scarification + living tissue => Linking ability; Linking ability + intent => Age linking
  • Bahro inter-Age linking technology for non-Bahro: Bahro "bubble" + stone + symbol => Linking "booth"; Linking "booth" + living tissue => Age linking
  • Bahro intra-Age linking technology for non-Bahro: stone + symbol => Linking pedestal; Linking pedestal + living tissue => linking elsewhere in current Age
  • Yeesha Journey cloth technology: cloth + pigment + symbol + cloth location => Linking destination; Linking destination + living tissue => New destination added to personal Age Linking Book
  • Yeesha-Bahro linking technology: cloth + pigment + stone => Linking stone; Linking stone + living tissue => Age linking

An important note: The linking stones and Journey cloths create dynamic (rather than static) destination links. Gahreesen is the clear example of this difference between D'ni and Yeesha-Bahro linking. D'ni-created Age links (through an Age Linking Book) always go to a static location, which is why in Gahreesen we land at the hub of the first rotating building. This is why the Gahreesen prison buildings were built to rotate perpetually, for this makes it impossible to use D'ni linking technology to access the building interiors in any location other than their hubs (and so makes an effective prison for D'ni criminals). Conversely, the prison cell linking stone always goes to the intended destination within the rotating cell; and the Yeesha cloth on the rotating upper deck creates an Age Linking Book link that always goes to the exact cloth location on the rotating upper deck.

As Yeesha reveals more to us beyond Gahreesen, she also shows us clearly that such dynamic links are optional, for she then uses static linking to reveal the secrets of Ahnonay to us. As mentioned before, Yeesha-Bahro linking is more powerful and more flexible than D'ni linking.

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