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PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:15 pm 
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Seeing as how big of an influence Star Wars was on the Myst saga, for those who've seen it, what did you think? Saw Robyn Miller's tweet yesterday and he said:

"I loved #ForceAwakens. My faith in #theForce has returned! Even #lightsabers are special again. Production design gave me chills.
Kylo is such a fascinating character. "I know what I must do. I don't know if I'm strong enough to do it.
"

So, opinions? :D I thought it was the best film since Empire Strikes back! The sense of mystery is back! The humour is badass. The characters are badass. The acting is Game of Thrones-level incredible... very theatrical. The writing is insanely good. The world building is spot on... weird, real, textured. Of course George Lucas is a bit bitter. Oh well... time to move on George.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:12 am 
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Although I did enjoy the movie, it had severe issues.
-The new music didn't sound like Star Wars music, a problem that was jarring each time they reverted to an old character motif.
-Kylo Ren was a great character when he was being a villain, but when he had his helmet off he became an angsty teenager. Doesn't work for a character in his position in the story, especially when they're trying to follow the structure of New Hope. Probably would have worked better if we only saw a glimpse of that side of him.
-The two main aliens (Snoke and Maz Kanata) were done with extremely obvious CGI, and would have benefitted highly from the practical effects they used for many of the other aliens. They seemed like cartoons, much more so than the others.
-The tone was way off, and flipped back and forth way too often. One example is that about thirty seconds after Han's death, there was a cheerful and celebratory scene where Po was running the trench and blowing up the planet. The audience was given no time to mourn before the movie began to cheer about how great the Resistance is. Every scene with tension or suspense was ruined by the small bits of comic relief and happiness injected into EVERY scene.
-Po was too overpowered. Every time he showed up, he shot down every fighter and blew up every enemy. He had very little depth to his character; he was just there so JJ could have as many dogfights as he wanted without any consequences.
-BB-8 seems way too sleek and dextrous in a world where machinery is harsh and primitive. While I understand that R2's lack of mobility was a hindrance to his usefulness as a character, BB-8 goes in the other direction and becomes a robot that can do TOO MUCH and can go ANYWHERE. Also, why would they make his head that shape? It doesn't fit on the sphere, and it's smaller than a standard astromech dome so it can't use the same parts or astromech ports.
-Finn was too lighthearted and funny, especially when combined with Han Solo. Now that Solo is gone, I expect Finn to fill that niche and be the sarcastic comedy relief, but the two of them together only added to making the movie way too upbeat.

But still, I enjoyed it. It's better than the prequels, but I'd have to put it below the original trilogy. I just hope JJ doesn't do the same thing he did with Star Trek and continue to make movies that are nothing but throwbacks and references; we don't need a new Empire Strikes Back any more than we needed a new Wrath of Khan back in 2013.

Now here's the question; is Kylo based on Jacen Solo, or is Kylo based on Kip Durron?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 1:38 pm 
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Dammit, tag your spoilers, people.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 1:41 pm 
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I think the thread title is clear and anyone who hasn't seen the movie and doesn't want to risk seeing spoilers will avoid opening it at all costs.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:19 pm 
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See I thought the complete opposite.

Kylo Ren is SUPPOSED to be an angsty teenager. He's what Anakin should've been! He's a Vader fanboy and is fraught with emotion and conflict... but its completely convincing with Adam Driver's incredible acting. Infinitely more interesting than Vader in a New Hope. There's only so much you can do with a stereotypical villain in a suit before it gets cliche. Having Kylo be a tortured character makes him more interesting and gives him depth. Why is he doing the things he's doing? The fact that he is pulled to the light like Luke was pulled to the dark is a creative mirroring of the original trilogy.

Kylo is the Sirrus to Anakin's Gehn if you think about it. Its a very Greek concept... the whole theme of family and betrayal/redemption. There are a lot of similarities between Star Wars and Myst that make you realize that these are modern day epics harking back to the ancient classics.

The writing was fantastic in this film along with the acting. I couldn't have thought of a better cast. Han's death was perfect. It gave the movie gravity and meaning. I know a lot of fans will hate having their icon killed but darn, that was daring on the part of Kasdan and JJ. Finally I FEEL EMOTION in a Star Wars film! It had to happen. It wouldn't have made sense otherwise. Also, Harrison Ford is 73. Let him retire with honor and grace.

Loved the practical effects. Loved the art direction. Yes the music was underwhelming. I mostly blame the fact that John Williams is 83 and used a freelance orchestra rather than the London Symphony ptrobably due to his age and not being in shape to travel. I still think Episode I had some of the best music in the saga. Too bad the film sucked.

Real locations really added depth and magic to the world. Takodana, Jakku, Starkiller Base. I'm hoping in Episode 8 or 9 that Luke and Rey return to Naboo to bring full circle to the three trilogies. For the all the hate the prequels get, I frakking LOVE Naboo! Perfect place for Luke to retire to. Maybe he could visit his mother's home and family.

I'm also hoping for a real dark and grim Episode 8. The director from Breaking Bad is set to direct VIII and he's known for being a thematically "heavy" director. I hope it goes in a new direction. New characters, interesting locales, great drama, etc.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:11 am 
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Tai'lahr wrote:
I think the thread title is clear and anyone who hasn't seen the movie and doesn't want to risk seeing spoilers will avoid opening it at all costs.

See, I read every thread out of habit. I only realised there were spoilers when the thread was already open (plus, there's a similar discussion thread on another forum I frequent, but there it explicitly states 'SPOILERS!!!' in the title)

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:57 am 
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Well, when it comes to any movie, you should really avoid all discussion if you want to avoid spoilers. I was barely on the internet for the week before release, and completely disconnected the day of, because I knew that people were going to spread around anything they could get their hands on. And really, who HASN'T seen VII yet?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:16 am 
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Most of the world apart from a negible few.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:41 pm 
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Twitch wrote:
And really, who HASN'T seen VII yet?

Me. Nor do I have any great ambition to do so. It's only a movie, my life won't change because of it.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:51 pm 
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Mac_Fife wrote:
Twitch wrote:
And really, who HASN'T seen VII yet?
Me. Nor do I have any great ambition to do so. It's only a movie, my life won't change because of it.
Hihi, the same applies to me too ... /me hides from rotten apples and tomatoes and runs ... :D

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:11 pm 
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janaba1 wrote:
Mac_Fife wrote:
Twitch wrote:
And really, who HASN'T seen VII yet?
Me. Nor do I have any great ambition to do so. It's only a movie, my life won't change because of it.
Hihi, the same applies to me too ... /me hides from rotten apples and tomatoes and runs ... :D

*raises hand* I don't plan on seeing it 'til the bluray/dvd comes out.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 7:11 pm 
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Twitch wrote:
..... And really, who HASN'T seen VII yet?

With worldwide ticket sales now well over $529 million as of today, and average ticket prices about $8.34 (in the U.S.; I haven't located a reliable worldwide average), we can estimate ticket sales at above 63,429,250.

With world population nearing 7,300,000,000, that leaves around 7 billion 236 million people who have not seen Star Wars Episode VII...give or take a few million.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 7:30 pm 
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Emor D'ni Lap wrote:
... and average ticket prices about $8.34 (in the U.S.; I haven't located a reliable worldwide average), ...

The basic adult ticket price at my local cinema (UK) is £9.25, which is just a bit shy of US$14, so factor that in...

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:29 pm 
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So if you folks don't care about star wars and don't plan to see it, why would you care about spoilers? Especially since this is a star wars discussion thread... why even open the thread in the first place?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:43 pm 
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There was no way I would ever click on this topic until after I saw Star Wars.

I enjoyed the film and I am leaving it at that as I have no interest in finding flaws and ways to not have enjoyed it. I went to have a good time without analysis, and I did.

My next comment is totally an aside and in no way represents any feelings I have about events in the film:

Yali wrote:
I know a lot of fans will hate having their icon killed but darn, that was daring on the part of Kasdan and JJ.

This reminds me of a complaint I have made many times over to friends and on others forums ever since "they" snuffed (a word I choose to more accurately describe my feelings toward writers' motives) Newt, Hicks, Bishop and Ripley in Alien 3, rendering Aliens pointless, and snuffed Kirk under a bridge in Star Trek Generations with one of the worst hero deaths ever in film history. They were a lack of respect for all the writers who previously tried to do justice to their characters and the audience. You hear it all too often: "One of your favorite characters will die in tonight's episode! Tune in at 9 Eastern, 8 Central to watch them die!!" It's nothing but lazy writing and a ratings grab of a show desperate to regain an audience because they have been too lazy to do a better job with their craft. As McCoy said in The Wrath of Khan, "It has always been easier to destroy than to create."

Newt is perhaps the most egregious violation and really the first film death ever to have made me angry at the writers from a point of view outside of the story itself. In the case of Alien 3, it was a deeply troubled production. Newt and Hicks' deaths were done because the plot needed them to be dead from the outset. It wasn't an organic continuation of the themes and character arcs of the last film. It was a literal hack job of multiple scripts to connect the prison-monk story they wanted to tell to where the previous one left off. Literally everything that happened prior to Ripley waking up again was a lazy contrivance.

From embattled Alien 3 director David Fincher:
David Fincher wrote:
...I'd always had this naive idea that everybody wants to make movies as good as they can be, which is stupid. [audience laughs] So I learned on this movie that nobody really knows, so therefore no one has to care, so it's always going to be your fault. I'd always thought, "Well, surely you don't want to have the Twentieth Century Fox logo over a [crappy] movie." And they were like, "Well, as long as it opens."

So again, only speaking to the general sense of the statement above, and not to Star Wars specifically at all, the snuffing of characters does not imbue writers with the quality of being brave, creative, or daring. It can be quite lazy, cynical, and even egotistically territorial when the writer's motivation is simply to leave their mark on a franchise like a dog to a tree. So like I said, this does not mean it is what happened in Star Wars and it is not a criticism against Yali because the story in Star Wars is a more organic continuation. But I want the world to look at writers who use characters for their own inorganically selfish purposes and shortcomings for what they are and not immediately assume death means quality drama. Make your voice heard when you see it.

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