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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:19 pm 
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Former MystOnline Moderator

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I see nothing wrong with attempting to direct someone to the proper forums as long as nothing regarding beta is given away. It's common knowledge that I was part of the original beta, so it would stand to reason that I would know something about general NDA stuff. I responded to conndarus immediately when I saw that there was a language issue (and saw that he was on the beta participants list). I gave nothing away but clearly stated that if he/she was in beta that the NDA would prohibit any revelation of that fact. That is common knowledge. I also sent a PM, but got a feeling that it was never read/received. I should have suggested tech support, but didn't.. :oops: ....thanks Ja'de for doing that. :)

It is also common knowledge ( or at least it is expected) that there would be a beta forum. I saw no harm in suggesting that he/she look for such, and I see no harm in Tweek's response to look for one. As far as Ingeniosa's response is concerned......I think he/she just responded as TG would have if he hadn't already been in beta! :mrgreen:

Bottom line, this community is about welcoming new members, not alienating them. Not responding is just as cruel as acidic remarks, IMO. There was an obvious language barrier, and if there was a problem distinguishing forums, then I think it was reasonable to think that there may also be a problem understanding the workings of a PM. Not everyone in our community is a techno wizard.

I take my participation in beta very seriously, but not to the extent that I will ignore or be cruel to someone who makes an innocent error.

I just hopt that conndarus didn't get scared away by all the PM's and manages to get through his/her problems and join us in testing.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:05 am 
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First, let me say that it is not really hard to tell who is in beta when you are not. All it takes is a little common sense. I've been responding to those types of posts all along with pretty much the same advice. I plan on continuing that as not to do so might look odd. Besides, I remember my first post on Ubi forums, the public ones, when I was accepted to beta. I had no forum experience at all. I really didn't feel very welcome over there nor did I receive any help until I found the beta forums.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:13 am 
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If the person is in the beta, and we see that by looking at the beta user group - can't we move the post to the beta forum and PM the person?

I see that my posts appear as a diferent color, but I don't know what kind of mod priviledges I have - can I move and delete posts?

There really haven't been many mistakes, and that last one looked like an honest mistake to me.

Which2 - nice response!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:24 am 
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Cyan Worlds has strongly stated the NDA will be strictly enforced. It has been established that we cannot release any information about beta or discuss the existence and terms of the NDA. Unless otherwise advised by Cyan Worlds about how far we can cross the lne to publicly help others, even an altruistic concensus among us cannot overrule the NDA we have signed. It is ill-advised to infer approval of helpful public discussion in violation of the NDA without explicit approval from Cyan Worlds of exactly what can be said publicly.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:40 am 
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Yes, those are the rules JWPlatt.
But there is a difference in a post done by accidence or a post done on purpose. And also the content of it.
Would it than not nice if somebody attents you that the post was in the wrong place?
New people are so excited to start in beta, so a mistake is easy made.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 1:00 am 
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Please read my original post at the top of the thread to see I am promoting prudent help via PM instead of through risky and embarrassing public forums. I think it's the best way. It's great, too, that we are getting together to use native languages to help these people.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:56 am 
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L'lee wrote:
Just a thought here, but... knowing that the original poster in question here was French Canadian, I think that there might have been a bit of a language barrier issue as well...

Whatever the reason for an accidental breach, I do think we all need to make sure that we season our responses with kindness rather than vinegar. :D

I, too, sent a PM to conndarus, I just didn't see the need to post that I had done so originally... But it does make me wonder just how many similar/identical helpful PMs s/he received... Sometimes too much help can be just as overwhelming as none at all... Poor thing! (I wonder if s/he felt trounced by the response....)


uulp!!

.... Guilty of additional PMing as charged.

But as Rusty and JWP and others have said, no public discussion means just that.

So there is no way for any of us to know how crushingly helpful we are being.

Poor conndarus checking their mailbox..

"you have 147 new emails..."

I would be terrified of some spammed virus trying to attack!!

And Whitch2, I thought your post was fine, and as you state, did not reveal non-public information. And I think Ja'de is right too, to an extent.
But I do think that "revealing" means some sort of active effort to communicate. I don't think that not posting, when you would have had you not been in beta, just doesn't cross that threshold of "actively communicating".

Sure, you might be revealing your beta status passively and inactively, but it doesn't seem to me to qualify as a Violation. With a capital V.

I think whether or not we should continue to post in the same way we did before we became betas is an entirely different question. And I think Ja'de is entirely right on that. We should. But just vewwwy cerwfully.


:D


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 5:21 am 
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Cyan Employee

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Excitement and common mistakes,

Let’s not worry about this issue anymore. I have told the mod team now what I would like them to do. Cyan will enforce the NDA, but if the mistake looks like he person was excited or a common mistake I will use discretion. Now if a person is taking video and photos and putting them on the web for all to see….. Then I have a huge issue with that.

I am still getting the Mod team up to speed and I thank them and you to bear with me.

Thanks

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 1:59 pm 
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Yeah! It sounds like a sensible and reasonable way to deal with the issue. Rules are made for human to aid their cohabit not humans are made to enforce and obay rules at all cost. Down with the red tape! :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:04 pm 
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greydragon wrote:
I am still getting the Mod team up to speed and I thank them and you to bear with me.


By the way do we have a mod for the German speaking section? IMO it would be wise to have at least one mod that can understand a foreign language. Maybe two mods would be better in the case a mod is sick or on vacation.

Tiran

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:17 pm 
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Tiran, this has been raised here. There isn't a German-speaking mod yet, though that does seem to be the intention.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:43 pm 
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Rusty_Russell wrote:
Tiran, this has been raised here. There isn't a German-speaking mod yet, though that does seem to be the intention.


Intention? :shock:

Well, the posting reminds me of the simpson's episode Cape Feare

Quote:
Pasty-Faced Lawyer: Robert, if released, would you pose any threat to one Bart Simpson?
Bob: (faking innocence) Bart Simpson? (chuckles) The spirited little scamp who twice foiled my evil schemes and (maliciously) sent me to this dank, urine-soaked hellhole?
Officer: Uh, we object to the term, "urine-soaked hellhole," when you could have said, "peepee-soaked heckhole".
Bob: Cheerfully withdrawn.
Lawyer: But what about that tattoo on your chest? Doesn't it say, "Die, Bart, Die?"
Bob: (conciliatorily) No, that's German for "The, Bart, The."
(the spectators laugh and show understanding)
Officer: No one who speaks German could be an evil man!
Judge: Parole granted.


:twisted:

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:59 pm 
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Quote:
That's still 3 out of 5. And if they are indeed going to moderate those forums, shouldn't they be shown as such on the index?


Yes and yes , I am currently having issues making the Mods actual Mods... But it will happen soon.

Ryan


3 out of 5 - Dutch, French, Spanish
2 out of 5 - German, Italian

Edit: GD's added an Italian-speaking mod to his list.


Last edited by Rusty_Russell on Fri Oct 06, 2006 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 3:54 pm 
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greydragon wrote:
I have told the mod team now what I would like them to do.


Presumably for first time offenders this just means moving their post to the beta forums where we can all help them out without worrying about it. If they continue to post in the public area, that's bad, but there's no harm in just moving the thread to a more appropriate forum!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 7:44 pm 
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Is there a thread where we can notify a mod that yet another beta tester has gone astray? It's JAMES this time in the general non-beta forum.


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