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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:30 pm 
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gimlet wrote:
I think that Chogon's post needs to be carefully parsed. I read it as referring to online shards only, not the offline game, which AFAIK has and had sanction for fan-created ages to be added to the canon - otherwise the GOW and GOM would have been explicitly "de-sanctioned" by Cyan. If this is wrong, I look for clarification from Chogon.

Erik wrote:
Does this include using Drizzle for off-line use?


Let's read that post again...
Chogon wrote:
Hi all,

Just to make clear Cyan Worlds' stance:

Cyan Worlds has *not* given any permission for the Drizzle program to the creator(s) of Drizzle or anyone using it or any derivative work of Drizzle. Also, we have not given permission to any shards that uses Drizzle derived data.
And we have not given any form of sanction to any shard outside of Cyan Worlds' control.

Thanks,
Chogon
(Emphasis added)

So no, he's not saying we have permission to use it offline or in certain cases -- we have no permission to use it at all.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:45 pm 
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"I'm beginning to wonder ... Does Bodger have my pony? "

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:56 pm 
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Zardoz wrote:
Well, they haven't given me my pony yet, either, so I'm really mad. I asked for a pony, so where is it? I've given them so much over the years, at least $12.36, so darn it, I'm entitled to a pony. What the heck is Chogon doing, anyways? Top priority, I'm sure he said, would be my pony. And now, nothing. I want my pony.


Good point Were just fans of Uru the world that would not die, and since their is no Uru live at least they know, even after all these years what they created so long ago is still popular

Personalty I would like to see Cyan go back to the MORE idea but instead of just wanting to break even I feel they should turn a profit from it, this might insure that the Caverns would stay open, assuming they can advertise to enough people to make it a profitable endeavor. Bottom line is simple it all comes down to money, if it aint profitable it aint happening

So who is open source gonna benefit and how . I hate mixing business with such thing cuz it makes me sound like a real horses backside, and I want Uru Live just as much as any one else but from a financial point of view I cant see Cyan making much out of it. either way whether its a rogue shard drizzle offline KI or open source

its almost like when GameTap was holding on to the rights to run MOUL with no plans to put it back on their servers, they where holding on to something and had no plans for it. If you buy stock that is not going any where why keep it?

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:52 pm 
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Karkadann wrote:
its almost like when GameTap was holding on to the rights to run MOUL with no plans to put it back on their servers, they where holding on to something and had no plans for it. If you buy stock that is not going any where why keep it?

Because one day it might make money?

Anyway, that analogy doesn't really fit here, as Cyan didn't 'buy' this stock, they created it.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:05 pm 
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kaelisebonrai wrote:
May I note, that Cyan has given permission to UAM (A part of Drizzle)

UAM is also stand-alone, or it was at one time, and it has been around since 2005. I don't know if it was ever approved or not.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:20 am 
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well the UAM and Drizzle aint going any where and personalty Uru CC would have been sitting on the shelf collecting dust if it wasnt for all the extras you can add to it.

Do you think Uru CC would still be as popular as it is if there was noting more then whats on the two DVD's

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:49 am 
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I did note with interest part of Rand's Q and A..where he discusses what will need to be taken out of MOUL files for MORE or open source to be released...

part of it was the tools that allow Ages to be worked on in 3DStudio Max and added to MOUL...

those are exactly the tools we WILL need to add player made content and work on it. Is it not better to leave that part in and have it locked with code access for authorized users only? it seems to be causing twice as much to work to take the tools out and then have to re create them again?

just a thought.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:22 pm 
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Wafna wrote:
kaelisebonrai wrote:
May I note, that Cyan has given permission to UAM (A part of Drizzle)

UAM is also stand-alone, or it was at one time, and it has been around since 2005. I don't know if it was ever approved or not.


That was the ULM. UAM is the new system inside Drizzle.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:03 pm 
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:oops: Sorry. Just a lot of letters to me!

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:31 pm 
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ULM = Uru Library Manager
UAM = Uru Ang Manager

If your confused, it's because they basically do the same thing.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:36 pm 
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Dachannien wrote:
Be patient. This is a delicate juncture for Cyan, and they have to be careful to protect their interests. They've always been reasonable folks, and they've already said they want to work with the community on MOUL and such, but any unauthorized shenanigans can put that in jeopardy by making things worse for Cyan. Let them call the shots, and in due time we will all be rewarded for our patience.


Ha be patient. I have been patient since 2004. We are still getting the same old song and dance. I think 5 years of being patient is more than long enough. Yeah there was Until Uru, but nothing new added, kept my interest for like a month Then came MOUL which was shut down after 10 months, which I got bored with the presentation. So yeah what many others said my being patient is at its end. Open Source as far as I am concerned is only a pipe dream to attempt to keep interest in what community is left. From reading the Q & A at Mysterium I am even more convinced that Open Source or MORE will never happen. Even though it was hinted around, there was no definitive yes it is going to happen and very soon, it is still just only a plan.

As I recall at the end of MOUL Cyan Worlds encouraged us to band together with the 4 guilds so the community could get organized etc. Well they have done that and now we get slapped in the face for it saying, sorry none of this has our permission. Well I'm sorry I am done being patient.


Last edited by J'ffrey on Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:40 pm 
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Actually, no, Whil, I'm not confused.

UAM predates ULM, it was once stand-alone.

ULM was used more commonly until UAM once again took precedence when it was combined with Drizzle.

UAM, as greendragon says is Uru Age Manager. It was aproved by Cyan many years ago.

Lemme just check the dates on the old UAM (no, not ULM) UAM (Yes, I am not confused) Was made in 2005, by Dustin (aka ddb174, author (among others) of Drizzle)


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:58 pm 
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kaelisebonrai wrote:
Actually, no, Whil, I'm not confused.

UAM predates ULM, it was once stand-alone.

ULM was used more commonly until UAM once again took precedence when it was combined with Drizzle.

UAM, as greendragon says is Uru Age Manager. It was aproved by Cyan many years ago.

Lemme just check the dates on the old UAM (no, not ULM) UAM (Yes, I am not confused) Was made in 2005, by Dustin (aka ddb174, author (among others) of Drizzle)

Yes, this is 100% correct :)


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:15 pm 
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J'ffrey wrote:
As I recall at the end of MOUL Cyan Worlds encouraged us to band together with the 4 guilds so the community could get organized etc. Well they have done that and now we get slapped in the face for it saying, sorry none of this has our permission. Well I'm sorry I am done being patient.

Well, there's a massive difference between Cyan saying "form guilds, organise the community", and them saying "form guilds, organise the community, and while you're at it have a go at hacking our software - see what you can do".

I think it's fairly obvious that Cyan would never say the latter, so why people are surprised that Cyan aren't rubber-stamping this behaviour is beyond me.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:05 pm 
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I know it is easy to try to read more or less into a statement than what was actually stated because there is a lot of grey area all around.

The reason for the statement is that from various communications Cyan has seen in the last month, a number of people think that Cyan Worlds has officially either sanctioned, given permission to, given the "OK" to or approved of certain shards, tools, etc.

The statement is simply that we have not given any such official permission or approval or sanctioning.


Cyan Worlds will in the near future reveal it's future plans and intensions. Hopefully, with a town hall kind of meeting, questions can be answered and a way forward charted.

I know that there has been a lot of confusion for the last year and a half. Not only in the community but also inside of Cyan Worlds. There are *so* many things we want to do from getting everyone back in the cavern to new fresh ideas. We have had to re-adjust our thinking but the dreams are still alive.


And Bodger, if you know where the ponies are would you please turn them lose. ;-)


Thanks,
Chogon


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