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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:20 pm 
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I know I am going to be crucified for saying this, but UrU's story was very very bad. I have been very pleased with Riven and Revelation's stories but the nonsense story that is UrU just saddens me. I realize that it was supposed to be online and all that, but from the "destruction is coming" theme that I've seen so far I fear that the new content will be composed of jibberish as well. I think it's time to go back to real stories instead of random philosophical blabbering.


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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:30 pm 
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Not only was it supposed to be online, but the story never really started.

The offline game was "What can we do to make Ubi happy, get the game with a few starter ages into people's hands, but without actually starting the real story?"

Prologue was "What can we do to fill the time and build some suspense, but without actually starting the real story?"

Whichever "story" you're worried about, offline or prologue... both had the same issue. You're absolutely right that it wasn't a real story.

Fear not and have faith. :)

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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 8:28 pm 
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It might help to think of Uru ABM as a sort of prologue for Myst 5


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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 9:01 pm 
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Acctuly, the story line was ok, but how they told it was very bad.

The problem that was in uru live befor ir got closed down, the story was told through a live run character that gave news and talked to the ppl, well in the mmo world this is a very bad way to go. in a mmo where you will have hundreds(maybe thousands) of ppl playing. you do not have a live event where ppl will miss out on things. This is why a mmo has to be set up in a way where everyone can interact with a NPC that can tell the same story over and over again and at any time when needed. call the npc a marker to keep the story going, but leave it open for ppl to explore and get other clue on there own.

There was many times i missed out on what was said by the drc person that came in to tell what he had to say in live beta back then. In a regular mmo ppl would of been very mad. What live needs is a series of npc's from start to finish that help a person along the story line, and sometimes quests to help things down in the cavern. Some of the quests can help open up new things or just keep ppl busy. rewards can be extra cloths, or hints to something down the road. The list is endless when coming up with a story to follow, and where you find the next part of the adventure to continue with.

I been playing to many mmo's for years, and i hope the story in uru live will be better and have more things and npc's to interact with

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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 9:16 pm 
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Cyan has mentioned that live persons were never intended to be the method by which events would occur in Uru Live. They are quite aware of the pitfalls therein...

The Prologue events were a special contingency plan to cope with a delayed rollout of Uru Live*. Events run by a live person are simply not scaleable. At the end of Prologue, Cyan had only three servers running (Atrus, Katran, and Achenar). Co-ordinating a single event across many servers would have become impossible.

* The alternative was to not let anyone onto the servers at all until Live was ready to run. I think Cyan made the right choice - if I had never gotten into Prologue, I doubt I'd be as passionate about seeing Uru Live return as I am today.)

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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 11:27 pm 
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This can be easily resolved by being able to ghost link (as in look but not touch) to the site of the event, and watch it unfold.


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 1:10 am 
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Uru's story is not bad. It's a matter of taste, realize that. I prefer Uru's story to any of the other Myst games, excepting only Riven. And I'm a little tired of hearing people apologize for Uru by saying "it was never meant to be as you see it...".

Those who think Uru is bad seem to have forgotten Teledahn, Sharper's journals, Phil Henderson, The Kadish storyline...

*sigh*

Can't understand you people.

Andrew

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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 2:01 am 
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I don't agree at all...

Umm, for starters... ...although I enjoyed Myst IV... Revelation's plotline was... absurd. It was just plain... silly. It was almost Lost In Space-style campy...

Uru is not nonsensical...

Uru has a brilliant plotline that's executed in a pretty fantastic, non-linear sort of way. It's not a plot that you're guided directly through, it's a plot where you only can really see the edges of what's really going on. You have to listen to what you're told and draw what conclusions you can and read between the lines. I think it's amazing, deep, and incredibly well done.

Uru has an incredible theme, and all manner of interesting subtextual-type stuff... I'd go into this more, I just don't have the energy to type all that just now...

Couldn't ask for anything more and I hope that Cyan continues this way...


~Joey Zoondeeshii


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 2:53 am 
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Congradulations man, I just got myself a new siggie.


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:50 am 
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When it comes to URU. It really doesnt matter if your there all the time or that you miss anything said by any official NPC or the DRC.

Why do I say that, well mainly because its suppose to be US playing ourselves and with our lives outside of the cavern we are bound to miss something that was said. Well unless we are so obsessed we forget about our lives outside the cavern ;)

What needs to be done to progress the story for some that aren't around(for whatever reason) is a postings that can be set ingame, Maybe on the imagers in the neighborhoods. If a DRC member has a statement it would be sent out in the Ki's and/or the imagers

Other ways of getting information would be great and could be used to progress the story. it might not be the same, but it would alow people to catch up on whats going on.

It's my belief thats what the neighborhoods are for. Either way its done I liked and still do like URU's story.:)


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:56 am 
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Uru's story is only bad in the sense that it forces you to actually be you.
The "you" that atrus has been talking to all these years.
"my friend..."
I mean, Atrus is great and all, but I just don't wanna be myself. I'm a cook in canada, not an interdimentional explorer. I just can't picture myself as such. I mean, I created a cute little redhead female character (I'm a man) just so it would be a little more like taking on a role. Not to mention she's easier to look at!
But I rather don a robe and be a mysterious D'ni citizen any day of the week.
That I would pay for every month.


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 8:50 am 
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I, for one, have always been happy about the "realtime live events" that happen only once and are guided by characters played by Cyan.
Uru is all meant to be real, and I would be very annoyed if my in-game experience consisted mainly in hearing pre-registered speeches like the one Yeesha gives at the end of the journey. This could be what other games are all about, but it's not what Uru is about.
Uru is not meant to be played. Uru is to be lived.
BTW, Cyan has stated that there will be a sort of Library where one can replay past events. But it is important to understand that what happens in Uru, like in real life, happens once and never again. This is what gives meaning to real life events, and makes them special.

And how could we play D'ni characters if we don't know D'ni history and culture like we should? If we cannot even read and understand D'ni writings? I like roleplaying, but I really don't like the idea of being a D'ni character. It would make no sense at all IMO. We were not a D'ni when we were the Stranger in the Myst games, though we were free to imagine ourselves as we liked. We are still able to shape our story and our appearance in Uru, bu we are meant to be humans in the 21st century.

Uru is happening now. It's happening to us. This is what makes it unique.

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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 10:00 am 
I wouldn't crucify anyone for expressing an opinion about the Uru storyline. (Quoting someone sarcastically out of context to make a "witty" signature, now...pass me the nails.) I would expect that someone to provide some specific reasons for his opinion rather than a blanket condemnation, but that would just be me.

Uru's storyline does touch on philosophical issues, but not in a "random" way. It is, as we know it, incomplete, and open to interpretation many different ways. When Live returns, there may be less scope for interpretation, and in some ways that makes me sad...but it will be worth the wait to find out what was really going on.


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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:54 pm 
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goofy wrote:
...its suppose to be US playing ourselves and with our lives outside of the cavern we are bound to miss something that was said. Well unless we are so obsessed we forget about our lives outside the cavern ;)

What needs to be done to progress the story for some that aren't around(for whatever reason) is a postings that can be set ingame, Maybe on the imagers in the neighborhoods. If a DRC member has a statement it would be sent out in the Ki's and/or the imagers.


Good point goofy. I concur.

In real life, we do not get to be everywhere all the time to know what is going on. We go to work each day and learn about the things that took place while we were away from others. We catch up on the news from tv, papers and the internet. Why can't Uru Live be the same since it takes place in the present, with modern day participants?\

I like goofy's suggestion that another method of getting information to the visitors about the current activities and DRC plot line is needed. My suggestion is that players, when they return to the cavern after time away (to the surface for rest and relaxation obviously), should check in at the classroom of their neighborhood. This should be updated very regularly by the DRC, there are imagers there, as well as notebooks, drawing boards and lots of space to add more. The classroom would give everyone the chance to catch up on new developments and changes in the cavern.

Why is it in modern MMORPGs, players feel they are entitled to experience and participate in every single event or story of the game? Because you pay a monthly fee doesn't mean you have to be there for every single thing - that isn't even realistic for an 'NPC' to just repeat an event over and over and over... it ruins the realism. You pay for cable tv too but you don't get to watch every single program ever, that would be impossible. The same goes for games. If they want the widest audience possible, then they need to broadcast times and dates of 'meetings' with DRC etc. as well as lots of ways for players to catch up on the changes and happenings in the storyline (ie. the classroom, notebooks, KI messages etc.)

Now, as for the actual game plot aside from the modern (DRC) restoration theme of the cavern, I have this opinion:

Uru's storyline is about us, real people from the surface, adventuring into D'ni and the ages provided from Yeesha's initial guide and 'request' in the cleft. The ages and quest to find the 7 journey cloths in each were meant as a way for the adventurer (who heard the calling according to Zandi) to be introduced to the history and the underlying theme of D'ni's destruction... how the people got to the point they were and why they disappeared or destroyed one another or whatever happened. The mystery of it is left open ended and presumeably would have gradually been more and more unraveled as time went on in Uru Live.

I have to agree that URU, Ages beyond Myst, seems a little flat and unfinished as a story if played single player and never included into Uru Live. Had I played it that way, I would not have enjoyed it nearly as much as I did by playing it via the Live version long ago. Marten and many others have already said this also.

Some don't like the 'apologetic' way some try to dismiss the lack of plot on the fact Uru Live was canceled years ago. I don't think it's apologizing or making excuses for the lack of storyline, it's just an unfortunate circumstance. Again, Uru was meant to be played live, it was only an option to play it single player and offline and probably not the best option in my opinion.

The BEST way to experience the ages and the mystery of the story is to descend into D'ni as directed by both Yeesha and Zandi, and join in the adventure with others from the surface (that's US remember). All the DRC notebooks, briefs and clues are not nearly as interesting or realistic when done solo. Take someone with you, explore the ages as a team, go to your neighborhoods and the cavern hotspots and talk to other people about it, THAT's the way the story is most fun.

This -is- really a roleplaying game you know. While you're not roleplaying a fictional ancient D'ni (I am not saying you can't, but that it's not the current idea), nor are you some fantasy person from another dimension or world (no elf ears here!) ... you ARE playing a fictional role in a fictional world. You can be anyone you want, so it doesn't mean you have to make yourself look and talk or act like yourself. You can make someone who's a scientist, or perhaps a nonbelieving skeptic trying to debunk the myth of the D'ni altogether. Maybe you're a journalist, or an anthropologist studying the clues of other races within the ages? Maybe you're a supporting assistant to the DRC? The possibilities are endless, but "URU" means "You Are You" and so you -can- just be yourself in this adventure if you want, that's the best part!

The story is still mostly untold. I, for one, am glad it's not even started yet.

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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 7:42 pm 
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The thing about plots is that what makes a good one is so incredibly subjective.

You mentioned you liked the plot of Revelation. So did I. But I've also heard people complain that it was really lame. It's just a matter of what people like.

I agree the plot of the single-player game seems a little vague and incomplete, but as mentioned, it wasn't intended to be complete. You can't make a game that both stands completely alone and acts as a lead-in to online play; they're contradictory goals. I think that Cyan did about as well as they could trying to work it out. This isn't to excuse the faults the game does have, but just to say it would be pretty much impossible for it to not suffer any identity confusion, and it could be much worse.

I also agree that it would be frustrating to play Uru Live for a long time and get to see things happen only secondhand through chatlogs and even video. In the real world we do catch up on the news via papers and TV, but stuff really happens to me, too. I think it would feel like a lot of work without much payoff if you solved puzzles in Age after Age but never got a chance to participate directly in the story in any meaningful way.

That's why I think the best solution is to mix repeated NPC stuff with some spontaneous actor-driven events, so everyone gets to see something, but there's still a feeling of excitement that you might get to take part in something big and unexpected sometime.

I actually like Uru a lot. I like that it made me think about what D'ni was, and what a restoration should be. I understand it's not for everyone, but it was for me and for a lot of other people. People are allowed their opinions, and no one can legislate matters of taste. :)

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