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Do you sitll use XP
Yes 22%  22%  [ 9 ]
No 51%  51%  [ 21 ]
Not on my primary computer 27%  27%  [ 11 ]
I don't know 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 41
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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 9:58 pm 
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No key is a stupid thing to do, I guess that's one more reason NOT to get Windows 8.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:03 pm 
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The practice is to include a recovery partition with the computer. You bought a computer, not an OS license. Therefore, you do not need a key. Keys are holdovers from the days when HDDs were so small that we had to ship out physical OS media :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:04 pm 
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What Adam said...

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:21 am 
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Do the recovery partitions usually let me keep my documents or do they restore my whole computer to a "factory state"? If I am being restored to a "factory state" then reinstalling Windows *might* be less painful. Also what happends if my motherboard gets completely fried(after the warranty is void) and I want to install my copy of Windows on a new machine, I can't do this without the key. You COULD legally do this with a valid key and a call to MS in the past.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:18 am 
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Jamie Marchant wrote:
Do the recovery partitions usually let me keep my documents or do they restore my whole computer to a "factory state"?

IME the former. It blows away the registry and all the OS stuff, but your junk is left in place.

Jamie Marchant wrote:
Also what happends if my motherboard gets completely fried(after the warranty is void) and I want to install my copy of Windows on a new machine, I can't do this without the key. You COULD legally do this with a valid key and a call to MS in the past.

You bought a computer, not an OS license (ergo you get to do that only because support likes to be nice to people). Besides, if you're clever enough to be doing that, you have probably built your own PC and have a real Windows disc.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:47 am 
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What Adam said...again

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:16 am 
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cpt-jericho wrote:
Robin wrote:
I "upgraded" to Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit last year on my desktop machine from XP.

Normally you can get a 64bit version for free from MS using your 32bit key.

Nope, not with the "school/student" upgrades at the time. One disk or key per machine to upgrade, from whatever Windows operating system.

This was not selling the initial operating system, just the upgrade. Nor could I buy two copies of the 64-bit upgrade, or any of the other available software packages through the school. Just one copy of each product or version per student per their agreement with Microsoft. So I also ended up with a copy of both Office 2007 and 2010, one for the desktop and the other for the laptop.

Now, Adobe was letting me install their Creative Suite on both machines, which makes sense in that I could create things on the desktop machine, as well as use the laptop at school to continue working or display the results in class.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:09 pm 
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Jamie Marchant wrote:
Do the recovery partitions usually let me keep my documents or do they restore my whole computer to a "factory state"? If I am being restored to a "factory state" then reinstalling Windows *might* be less painful. Also what happends if my motherboard gets completely fried(after the warranty is void) and I want to install my copy of Windows on a new machine, I can't do this without the key. You COULD legally do this with a valid key and a call to MS in the past.

Hi, everyone, what you're all saying might be right, you're the specialists lol, but that doesn't really help Jamie or anyone else maybe one bit ... :P

Since I've got my first computer in 1998 I've always kept a system backup somewhere, on a separate partition and/or on an external harddrive, to have both might be better in case of a complete crash ... :mrgreen:

I started with the awesome 'Partition Magic' (which is now Norton) by PowerQuest back in the days, which one had to buy, but it was worth every penny, and now I'm using everything by Paragon Software, which for me seem to be the best in all things partitioning and backup and recovery etc., the best as for convenience and easy handling for non-specialists lol, and above all as for reliability, it is almost impossible to do sth wrong and mess it all up lol ... Additionally you create a bootable stick/CD/DVD to get the machine working when the screen remains black or to repair sth etc. ...

This programm has saved me already twice lol, but besides that it made my computer life so very much more easy and relaxed ... if you accidentally download some bad stuff or your machine starts to work strange for whatever reason, I just load a previously saved clean system backup and everything's working smoothly and properly again, you have to have a clean backup ready on a partition and/or external harddrive/DVD etc. in the first place of course and renew it from time to time ... Their 'Partition Manager' is also great and free btw, though I bought it with my computer in 2011 ...

The special program I'm talking about above is called 'Backup & Recovery 2013 Free' and as you already see it is completely free, but full with awesome options, which are even fun just to play with, and of course it now supports Windows 8 32/64-bit ... :)

What is important here to notice is, like that I never had to bother with my Win keys by now, 'cause you're always backing up that whole system drive (C:) ... So, my handling seems to be an interesting solution to consider when having to deal with Windows 8 ... :D

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:04 pm 
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I've asked the mods to move these Windows 8 posts to my Windows 8 thread since it's not related to the topic "still using, XP". Lets wait for them to move it or continue the conversation on that thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:43 pm 
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recovery partition :roll:

burning DVDs is not what i call safe (less than having the factory ones) so, when your drive crashes (happened to me), better to have several copies

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:24 pm 
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janeerah wrote:
recovery partition :roll:
burning DVDs is not what i call safe (less than having the factory ones) so, when your drive crashes (happened to me), better to have several copies
... what she said above ... 8) ... this extensive account contains everything, a very safe way to master almost every situation. Only one time in my life nothing worked anymore, that was when a mighty lightning stroke (outside, I'm glad lol) destroyed my computer (through the electricity system) completely ... :D

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:42 pm 
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AdamJohnso wrote:
The practice is to include a recovery partition with the computer. You bought a computer, not an OS license. Therefore, you do not need a key. Keys are holdovers from the days when HDDs were so small that we had to ship out physical OS media :roll:


Well, for several of the recovery options in Win8 Microsoft requires you present the key by typing it into their web site and in several scenarios before the re-install program will run.

There is a product key in Win8 & 8.1. You just have to retrieve and save it before you crash. Each Win8 system I've recovered has required the use of a product key when install could not find the key on the hard drive or in CMOS memory. Adam's idea that you bought a computer thus an OS License is not needed is just not true. Prove it to yourself by looking at the sales ticket for your computer. It will list the OS License as an item purchased. Best Buy and Fry's does not include the Product Key on the sales receipt. They do list the OS item.

If the recovery partition works and allows you the type of recovery process you need, it should have the product key within itself. So, you won't need to find it. But, the software will be using the key.

Several clients tried to get Best Buy and Fry's to recover the Product Key from the crashed computer or their sales records. They were not able to do it. They refer them to the manufacturer or Microsoft to chase down the key. If you are in a hurry, that is a pain.

Recovery partitions are handy in many cases. But, when the hard drive fails, you are out of luck as the recovery partition is gone too. You most likely will find yourself having to buy a recovery disk/usb stick from your computer's manufacturer. Whether on the unit's hard disk or recovery media, they contain a complete copy of the OS and drivers, which requires a license (Product Key).

If you decide to get a generic Win8 or 8.1 recovery disk from eBay, you are going to need your product key to run it. Manufacture's media either has the Product Key (they will require your units serial number) or can recover it from the unit's hardware (CMOS BIOS).

Should you decide to upgrade and replace the hard drive you run into a problem re-installing without the key.

Change the computer enough to break the hardware authorization key match and you will often need the key to authorize via the MS site.

My point is: If you are used to using XP Product Keys and move to Win8 or 8.1 you are very likely to get bit by how MS now handles their Product Keys now. Get a copy of it while you can.

Recovery Paritions
These vary by manufacturer. The older XP, Vista, and Win7 partitions may or may not have various recovery options. Some just reformat the main partition and reinstall factory state. You lose your stuff. Others have the standard Windows repair options.

Win8 - 8.1 recovery partitions and disks usually have multiple recovery options that can allow one to recover the operating system and keep their stuff. They also have the nuclear option to lose everything and restore factory new state.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:11 pm 
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Wait why can't you just backup the recovery patarstion onto an external hd, does the partistion only run off a drive with the same serail number as the one it was installed on?

Nalates wrote:
If you decide to get a generic Win8 or 8.1 recovery disk from eBay, you are going to need your product key to run it.

This assums that a "CD only" copy of Windows 8 is cheaper then a copy with a CD key and coa(which I'm not sure about). It also assums you can use a diffrent prodcut key with a diffrent CD.(which MAY not be the case, if one of them is a OEM key and the disk is a retail disk).

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:59 pm 
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Jamie Marchant wrote:
Wait why can't you just backup the recovery patarstion onto an external hd, does the partistion only run off a drive with the same serail number as the one it was installed on?
Of course you can, Jamie, that's why I've explained it in a very easy way from a longstanding layman experience for all who become discouraged and confused with other info which doesn't offer a real solution ... :P

Do what I've said above and use great free software to do it all for you ... I don't make a backup of the recovery partition, I've said it all above, I make my backup from the whole main C: Windows system drive only (not the other partitions), and I save it to a different partition, and it contains everything you've installed with all options and adjustments, registry settings etc., just the whole Windows system as of at the time of your backup, which will be restored if you tell the program to do just that, and I save it additionally to an external harddrive just in case I couldn't reach onto my computer anymore, means in case of a crash with a black screen, then you use your program's bootable security/recovery CD or DVD to reach out for your Windows backup on your harddrive or on your external drive (this security CD or DVD can always access your computer unless it'd be destroyed lol) ... As I've stated above, like this I've never needed my serial numbers again ... It is that easy, really ... :D

Edit: With Mac's post I'd like to add that OEM versions of Windows can do this all only on the computers they've been pre-installed on, when that machine dies the OEM Windows license dies with it ... Good to know, I never thought of that as I anyway had to buy a new computer when the old one died or became outdated or lame etc. ... :)

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Last edited by janaba1 on Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Still useing XP?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:04 pm 
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Nalates wrote:
AdamJohnso wrote:
Adam's idea that you bought a computer thus an OS License is not needed is just not true.
That's not what Adam said - if you read the context, he was pointing out that OEM licenses (as typically shipped with off-the-shelf PCs) have a license that applies only to the specific hardware with which it is shipped and the license dies with the machine. That's why it's cheaper than a "retail" version that can be moved to other PCs. Hence if your mother board fails and you have to replace it then your license expires, so the question of whether you have the key or not is an entirely moot one since the license that it was tied to no longer exists.

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